Hey Gerry. The site looks nice enough. Good blog… Barry is no big loss in my opinion. A huge loss would be Xabi and I have a bad feeling that either he or Javier would be going if the right offer comes along from the Spanish giants. Added to that, the fact that our top targets are going elsewhere, you just have to wonder who we are eventually going to sign. Maybe Rafa will pull a rabbit out of a hat and grab a quality player nobody is even looking at. Gotta wait and see I guess.

Great Blog Gerry and the Headline was one of your best. The new look is fun, after finally figuring out what to do, the techie stuff is also not my strong suite.
I cannot wait for the silly season to finish and the games to begin and what ever happens Rafa will spring a few surprises and get it right more often than not.

I feel for Rafa. All of us expect him to pull an absolute rabbit out of the hat again this transfer season. I fear that and i must say, i don’t see that happening.

With Man city and Real madrid (and now Portsmouth and Sunderland after their takeovers by billionaires) throwing millions at players, all our targets might be out of our reach already. The clubs will already be expecting bids atleast twice the actual evaluation of the players. We have never been financially sound to compete with that. This being the first year of Rafa in full control, i expected better playing ground for him. Things have worsened than last year and i don’t expect it to get better any soon.

With the yanks showing how good their business acumen is with a estimated loss in the 40 mill range, its just a matter of when and not if they are going to sell LFC. It better be soon for their as well as our own good. After all the promises of new stadium, its f**king irritating that the construction’s not even been started and after 2 whole f**king years.

Awesome analysis on our financial position

redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=243416.0

Congratulations Gerry on becoming another statistic. Come in – the water is warm!

I too find that Balague is seen as this Spanish Oracle of infinite wisdom – but is just using the same scatter-gun, no-shit-Sherlock approach as the rest of the coffee-slurping chain-smoking hacks. But we still like him as he’s not a cock – unlike the rest. I especially hate David(Bandwagon)Maddock.

I’ve decided that this summer was going to be a football free zone for me. No World Cup or Euros to look forward to, only mindless speculation for two months.

It’s probably best that the Dosser should go back to the land of Espresso. At his age, you don’t want to warm benches. He never looked comfortable out there for us, although he was a real trier with big heart; he just got caught in the headlights too often. Ah good luck to him, he did score against MU and Real – so kudos to him.

hey kinny, missed your last post #14. nah, i’m not a yank, i’m from the east, malaysia to be specific. i used to be Red Knight in this blog, but stopped writing for a while. now that we have Knight on board (also a fellow malaysian), i decided to go with Redneck, just because it’s got “red” in the name. i was wondering if all of us, instead of using gravatars we can use our own ugly mugs, just so we can see how we look like. like gerry who’s stopped using a pic of george clooney (it was clooney right ger?). i want to see how fat a certain grumpy auld scouser is.

any tips on loading the photos ?

Neilob #8, Go to here http://en.gravatar.com/site/signup/ and follow the instructions to sign up (with the email address you’re signed up to Kopblog with) and upload your photo.

Super stuff Gerry,

You definatley hit the nail on the head with the journo`s they are writing anything these days to fill space.Maddock in the mirror today said rafa was “caught napping” regarding Barry and he`ll struggle to find a replacement for alonso.I don`t even know why i even get these rags i suppose i have to do something when i`m having a shit!

Impressive new layout for the blog, Gerry. I might try out the gravatar but first I’ll need to find a suitable Liverpool-related pic.

No matter what the blog looks, as long as it’s Gerry writing stuff, I’ll be here as long as I’m alive, which is like another few hundred years.

Ah, Redneck, so you’re Redknight, I nearly couldn’t recognize you. You’re in KL, no? While I live somewhere else and hardly speak Malay, you could say I’m part Malaysian as I have lots of relatives from there.

That’s strange, I try to sign up my email for gravatar, but it says my email is already used.

Could this be because I already have an account with WordPress? I see my default avatar for WordPress is being used instead.

GED..I to think Barry was a nice to have as opposed to a must have.Let him go play for City
and have fun spending all that cash.
I enjoyed your comment about Two-faced and two Drs.lovely that.

It’s silly season and the rumours will abound.
We just have to keep our heads and let things play out.
Nice thing about now is I get to play a lot of Golf.
Cheers to all , enjoy your summers if your in the
Western Hemisphere..

This latest financial news was splashed all over the papers this morning, but it’s not news for those at Anfield. The report was for the year ending in July 2008; almost 12 months ago. It’s not all doom and gloom like the papers want to portray.

In the interim, Rafa’s penned a new deal(I’m assuming he knew the financial situation of the club before committing), as well as Stevie, Nando, Dirk, and Agger (I’m probably missing one or two more).

Rafa has culled the academy and youth set up and he’s putting it back together to develop players who can break into the first team. Rafa has an impressive background on youth development during his time at Real Madrid, so I trust he knows what he’s doing. The system wasn’t working in the sense that we haven’t had a player jump into our first team since Stevie.

This is being done so that the club can bring in talent and develop it cheaply over the long term. Until the stadium gets built (and I’m not so certain it will be with Dumb and Dumber around), we have to realize that our transfer funds will always be limited compared to our rivals.

To prove this point, Barca fielded 7 players who progressed through their youth system in their starting lineup last week when they won the CL Final(Valdes, Puyol, Pique, Busquets, Xavi, Iniesta, and Messi).

Too many people are getting caught up in how the cash (or lack of it) is going to affect Rafa’s transfer plans. I think the gaffer knows what he’s doing and I think the media are going nuts because all of our plans are not public knowledge.

It may take us out of the running for the Tevez, Silva, and Villa type players, but I think Rafa’s shown us he can bring in some gems. The money we spent on some of these players seemed quite high when we first spent it (Agger, Skrtel, Reina, Alonso, and yes even Torres), but Rafa has gotten value for his money many times.

The only things we really need to address are cover at RB, a 4th choice CB, and someone who can cover for when Torres and/or Stevie get injured, because history shows us they both will.

If we went through the silly season without buying a player, would it really be that terrible? We’re talking about a squad that took 31 of the last 33 league points on offer.

I think almost all of us felt like we just ran out of games to catch the Mancs.

Lets see if my gravatar is working

testing

Why isn’t mine working? Any ideas? I’ve followed the link on my e-mail account, cropped and finished my image. What else is there to do?

Kenny, did you use the same email address on gavatar that you used when you first registered to kopblog? I bet you didn’t.

Looking good Kenny

Are you using the same email address that you use for Kopblog?

LB would you stop pre-empting me!

I only have one personal e-mail address

And that’s always been the case? If so I’m not sure where your going wrong mate.

ttp://www.thisisanfield.com/kopblog/wp-admin/profile.php

click on the above link to check your registered email

I’ve clicked on the link and it shows up my gavatar.

i found that my image didnt show up for like 30 mins or so the first time around…it kept showing the blank image of the white outline of a person. but then i came back in a few hours later and it was my picture.

so dont expect it to be right away!

YNWA

redneck…i’m also a malaysian and seems like there’s quite a few here…including knight and i supposed puchong red?

I don’t want to be the only one without an image – boo hoo!

YK Leong, Redneck, Indeed I am pleasantly surprised quite a number of Malaysians here in this wonderful site. Are you members of LSCM? We normally meet at Cobra or Baywatch on match nights and quite a few early morning viewings during CL games, especailly QF or SF and definitely Finals. They are planning for trips to Bangkok and Singapore where the Reds will be played on 22 July and 26 July respectively. I am flying to Bangkok for that. Cheers.

LB, Thanks. I just remembered I had used a different e-mail when I registered. No wonder i could not get through. Now let’s see if my mugshot comes up..

Ahhh, that’s better. That’s me with Roy Evans at the Cobra Club last year.

Rick Parry made a complete hash of running the club and I am delighted @ his departure.His effort to sell the club was a joke.How come Man City,Arsenal etc have billionaire owners?.£20 million is peanuts to spend in the transfer market as most of that was generated from the sale of Keane!.

One target (Barry) down. A few to go. Hopefully we will get some of Rafa’s targets before the season starts, with Stg20 million extra that had been promised.

Frankly Dossena can go to Juve. No probelm here.
But Gerry, those British tabloids you mewntion in this blog are saying we may lose out on Mascherano (Stg 20-24million to Barca) or Alonso (Stg 24 million Real Madrid). It could happen, let’s face it. If so, it could be tearing apart our solid midfield.

Great blog Gerry. I sometimes feel I am banging my head against a wall. It’s getting to the point where I feel like I’m loosing my sense of humour, constantly nagging people to try and see the real picture…
A journalist’s job is to sell the paper – big the hype headline, more the chance of shifting papers.
Why does anyone pay them any heed?

Footballer = mercenary will kiss any badge for the right amount of dough.

I can’t even be arsed going on about either though. I’ve had my say a million times.

The only reason I have came back in is to say…
While we have been busy playing fantasy football with Rafa’s war chest, the truth has finally came to light – we are fucking skint.

Why did people believe we would have a minimum of 40 odd million to spend? I honestly do hate going on like this. There used to be a time I laughed and joked in here, but for months I have been trying to warn everyone that there would be no dough to spend.

Why did anyone believe that Rafa would be given at least 20 million plus the money from the Keane sale?

FFS within a matter of months this club could be in the hands of the recievers. I don’t want to panic monger or be a doom and gloom spreader. I also don’t think it will come to that. But it is a possibility and we are now really up against it, or as our American cousins would say – stuck between a rock and a hard place…. we could go into administration (with all that entails) or we could carry on like this getting deeper and deeper into debt until we do a Southampton.

I understand why people want to play fantasy football. I understand that concentrating on the doom is pointless and just plain depressing when there’s little or nothing you can do about it. But we should all at least understand the situation.

It’s alright saying we want Silva, Villa, or insert favourite players name here, but the reality of the fact is – if the worse comes to the worse we could actually be forced to sell Torres and Gerrard and all/any of the assests the recievers see fit.

I hate to say it. I have been saying for months that we are now on the verge of greatness. I still firmly believe this, but the horrible depressing fact is… if RSB call in the loans, we could be forced into recievership and all that entails.

Damn them yank bastards.

Don’t worry Knight, Rafa is no mug. If we do have to part company with Alonso, Mascherano will won’t be going anywhere.

Even if Xabi does end up leaving (which I really hope he doesen’t) I’m sure we will get more than £20m for him. That is just Real’s opening offer.

A suitable replacement could be bought if the price is right.

FS,

I realise the financial situation we are in.Well.TBH i`m not all that clued in on the money side of things but i realise we don`t have much money to spend.

When Rafa signed a new deal this year surely he was promised some kind of budget he was satisfied with?

Or maybe the two ducks are telling more porkies?

We`ll have to wait and see.

Rafa,whatever he`s up to,is keeping his card very close to his chest.Surely he`ll pull a diamond out for us will he?

Timmy please read what happened to Southampton FC when their parent/holding company couldn’t meet it’s debt repayments. And read what Hicks done to Corinthians.

FFS fat scouser i have been letting all this balls go over my head,because i new we were skint and just thought the media where looking to sell their rags!! However thats a few people now that have mentioned about southampton/leeds senario,on and off this website.

I was actually coming on here looking to read some positive feedback from the likes of yourself,so basically i could find some reasurance. I’m now having a mini freak-out about future events and am worried about what the future holds. I like most am limited on my knowledge of the finacial aspect of things and the only thing i’m certain of is with these to fuck wits at the helm we could be in for a really rough ride!!!

Just fuckin typical we get good,an theres a spanner………no a fuckin toolbox thrown in the works!!! aaaggghhhhhhhh

RR mate… the club/holding company are now in a position of unsustainable debt, so there can only be one outcome from two scenarios…
1: H&G sell the club.
2: The club is taken over by the banks (Administration) which means we can be forced to sell assets (Players) and will be docked at least 10 points.

Option 1 might give some hope, but the price H&G have put on the club makes this highly unlikely and any potential buyer would probably wait and try to grab the club for peanuts after it has gone into administration.

the two wanks are basically assest users they see sport as a way of keeping them in the headline whist making money doing other tings, they promised the earth to corintians but they nearly ended with nothing till it was bought out by someone else. we should just hope they become desparate and have to sel. prick parry has somthing to answer for. bit we still have a good managerand team who ever he brings in will no doubtbe some one who will fit in or he will ship them out. we have some good yousters coming up soon so in a couple of years wemay have a steady feed into the first team squad.lets hope it wont be long before the two wanks are up and away. heres hoping

Guess we must hope they get a buyer for the club so FS.Nobody wants to go into administration.Worst case scenario apart from the administration is they get the refinancing loan to prevent this from happening.I know it will only be a short term fix though until they have to repay that loan.

Moores and Parry both have a lot to answer for..
But will we ever know the real story of what
happened when G&H bought the club?

Lads skint we may be but second we came and nearly nicked it. We have a wonderful team and all our quality players are tied down to long term contracts.
.
We have signed Rafa up and he is busily rearranging his backroom staff.
.
You can’t ask more from a club than that. Rafa would not be staying if there was no reasonable chance of him winning the league.
.
FS you once made a comment about negative people, I think you said who gives a fuck if we get sent back to league 1, we’ll still support the team and have the best supporters in the world. And lads that still stands today.
.
How many lads on here would go and support Everton if we dropped out of the PL. NO-ONE.
.
The hype coming out of the papers is from 2007-2008. If anything things seem to be bubbling along quite nicely. Lets not fret lads.
.
There will always be a Red shirt running around Liverpool.

aye gaz, but that red shirt is more likely to be a pair of blood-soaked Armani shirts, worn by G&H, as they leg it through the streets, pursued by a horde of raging Sons of Shankly!

Do we really know if the club is still in financial strife?

Or are the media scaremongering after the state of our accounts last Summer?

I don’t know, but yes, it is a bit worrying when you look at the examples of Leeds or Southampton. Remember, Leeds were playing a CL semi final ome minute, and then the next thing we know the receivers were being called in!

I just hope this doesen’t happen to us.

I’m getting pissed off about hearing of possible Kuwati or Indian takeover talk, only for nothing to ever happen. H&G holding prospective buyers to ransom , perhaps?

What part of unsustainable don’t people understand?

FS,I read about leeds and the saints.Scary stuff my friend.

D-Day is 24th of july.We will know the story by then.So people will speculate until then but nobody really knows what the 2 ducks are up to.

Please G

Was going to say please god they`ll sell but i wouldn`t hold me breath.

This lad, just makes one feel proud that he’s playing us, Liverpool. YNWA.

http://www.liverpoolfc.tv/news/drilldown/N164666090607-0943.htm

Nice one, abhiram. It’s great to read quotes like that from LFC players, and in the case of FT I think most of us have always felt that he has a very special feeilng and affinity for LFC.

Steve the red, there is no scaremongering going on here. The facts are that we have earned ~10 million quid as a company for the year ending July ’08, which is an increase of ~30 million from the year before.

Even with this jump in profits we were still 40 million in the red, primarily due to interest payments on our loans. So, we don’t have enough money to pay off our debt!

Also I don’t think that the figures will be any better for ’09, so that’s another 40 million loss, at least. If we continue on like this we will be ‘fucked’ i.e. forced to go into administration.

I think that you will agree that this is not a pretty picture.

Morning Ladies I see everybody is reaching for the razor blades again. Accountants like Doctors have to give you the worse case scenario, even if there is a 0.1% chance of the tumor being malignant 6they have to tell you that it can happen.

Liverpool as a going concern is a viable business prospect, hence the 10 odd million profit we made, despite the reduced match day revenue because of our undersized stadium. The 46 million loss was due to the borrows having bought the club with a credit line and does not reflect the stability and salability and future revenue growth of the club. All it says is that the borrowers do not have the means to take us forward by themselves and will be forced to bring in another investor or sell the club outright.

The borrows know that we are a better bet financially, in terms of future revenue and growth, hence profits and that is why they are trying to sell their other sports franchises in order to fund LFC. With this in mind the Banks also know this, hence they will give them an extra 6 months to find a buyer or investor as well as forcing them to put more of their own money into LFC, hence making it more of a personal commitment and risk if they do not come up with the goods. We are in no danger what so ever to becoming a Leeds or a Southampton and the absolute worse case scenario is a forced sale by the banks to cover their exposure to the detriment and financial loss for the borrowers. They know this and will not allow it to happen, they will make sure they make at least some profit for their efforts. That is why the Arabs and the Indians are holding of. Out of all the clubs around the world we are the most attractive business and have by far the most potential going forward so all this talk of gloom and doom is far of the mark.

On a more positive note I see Rafa has personally gone and spoken to Silva, similar to the Torres approach and apparently he is confident that Johnson will reject Chelsea (Bosingwa and past experience) and come to LFC, rumor has us putting in a 10 mill bid. money is not everything if a player wants to come to us and rejects a move to a club that has put in a bigger offer.

Have faith we have the best manager in the world, not to mention best club, all we need is owners to match. However despite the borrowers we will succeed.

Keith usually there isn’t much we disagree on, but I have to say this…. There is absolutely every chance of LFC going into administration and bearing all the penalties that incurs – forced sale to highest bidder, forced sale of assets (Players), points deduction, etc.

I’m pretty sure the banks will extend the loan, so it won’t happen overnight. But, that only drags us further into the mire of debt.

I know you are only trying to look at best case scenario, but it contains far too many ifs, but’s, maybes and assumptions, while the simple facts are…
1: LFC is now saddled with a debt it can never pay off.

2: If/when the banks recall the loans LFC will go into administration, and be hit with all the pentalities that carries.

3: Find a new owner/owners – what someone to meet Hicks ridiculous valuation of the club for a 49% share in it, also to be saddled with all existing loans and the cost of a new stadium with no control over the club?

The last thing I, or I’m sure anyone else, wants to do is spread doom and gloom, but the fact is… we are in dire straights and why only LurganKop seems to understand this, or wants to face up to it, is beyond me.

SOS are now in the process of lobbying RSB not to extend the loans. They are only too aware of what this could mean to the club (Administration) but they are still willing to risk the very future of the club in a bid to get rid of H&G. And if that isn’t proof of how desperate our situation is, I don’t know what is.

We, i.e. LFC, posted a profit of 10 mil right? KOP Holdings, or the yank company that owns LFC, has shown a loss of 40 mil right? This was for 2008 too and before Rafa, his backroom staff and a host of players signed the contract. So i guess these guys must have known what they getting themselves into. I guess the yanks have found a solution to this problem or they have very convincingly lied to many people and more importantly Rafa. If thats the case, Rafa would have quit by now. Yet he’s still there. So i am not too worried. I was but i am not now.

Well, abhiram like you yourself have just said… that’s what you guess.

So, I shall leave you to your guessing… wonder whether Rafa is spending our 40 odd million plus war chest on Silva, Villa, tevez or Snoogy Doogy?

In the meantime I’ll use my time and energy in following the SOS guidelines as I’m obviously wasting both in here.

Abhiram, KOP holdings owns LFC i.e. even though the ‘LFC’ entity made a profit the group (Kop Holdings) made a 40m odd loss. It matters not which account, KOP holdings or LFC, these loses were made on, you should regard any loss as a loss for LFC!

As I said before, I am not an expert on this, but I believe that KOP holdings could move all this debt onto the LFC books, if they wanted to – just like the Glazers did for the manure.

So, for me, in the end it makes no difference, LFC lost 40 million in the year to July ’08 and, probably a similar amount until July ’09.

Another thing to note is that Kop Football (Cayman) Limited owns Kop Football (Holdings) Limited. So that is another layer of shite to get thru’. So theoretically Kop Cayman could pass its debt to Kop holdings and then onto LFC.

BTW, what do you think Rafa could do with 80 odd million in the transfer market?

Great stuff this leveraging business thing, eh!

As I said before I will willingly pass on the full accounts report to any red who wants to read it. Not the most exciting read but you may learn quite a lot about the state of our beloved LFC.

Lurgankop, Thank you for helping me with that. Its very appreciated. I just want to ask you this: Do you feel the yanks can come out of it? I mean to ask, can and will the yanks sell their other sports property and get us of our debt?

This think is really bothering me though. As mentioned in my previous post, why did Rafa and the others sign contracts when they knew about the loss for the year? There must be something that Rafa and other players and coaches know that we don’t. One more thing is i believe in Rafa. Since he’s committed himself long term, i am a little optimistic.

FS, i might have angered or irritated you with my ignorance. I am sorry for that but please do post your ideas.

And to your question Lugrankop, i think we really don’t need 80 mil to better our squad. Even if we buy a good RB, a back-up stiker and a winger, i don’t think it’ll cost more than 40 mil. 10 mil for a RB, 25 mil for a winger and 5 mil for a back-up stiker who’s ready to wait in the wings for long periods of time. If we go for a backup Cb as a replacement for Hyypia, then add 2 more. So 42 mil.

Lurgan,

I`d like to see those accounts if you don`t mind.You can mail me on [email protected]

I meant to ask you also how was your stay in Kerry?I`m sorry i couldn`t catch up with you my hands were tied around then.

Abhiram, I wasn’t really saying that we needed 80m to better our squad and win the league, although it would help. I was trying to illustrate how much money is seeping out of LFC due the these leveraging f**kers from the US of A!

The only way for Rafa to purchase more players is to sell or for the borrowers to borrow more, which is not likely and not good.

As FS says, we are basically… skint.

Timmy check your email for the doc.

BTW, my stay in Kerry did not happen. I tore a calf muscle playing football with me kids a few days before I was supposed to go!

Football always seems to fuck me up in one way or the other

Oh ya i recall that now i`ve a head like a siv sometimes.

I downloaded that i`ll look at it tomorrow after i send kids to school,cheers pal.

FS, the headlines from the daily rags would be dramatically different if we won the league.
.
1. LFC secure the PL title while on posting a 40 million loss during the worst fiscal downturn in history. They can bend the story to suit themselves.
.
Facts as you call them are.
.
1. We came second, I think we had 31-33 to finish the season.
.
2. Players tied down to long term contracts.
.
3. Several legends coming back to assist Rafa with coaching.
.
4. Parry out.
.
5. Rafa in control with a long term contract and stability returning to the club.
.
6. Percieved problems with transfers and cashflow.
.
Well if 1 out of 6 is the worst I can come up with I’m happy. I’ll still support this team regardless. Lets face it if we blew 100 million last year on winning the league no one would give a fuck.
.
Lets stay positive lads it’s the least we can do for Rafa and the boys. If hanging around or being there abouts is unsustainable, then we might as well drop down a league, otherwise we have to do all we can to compete. That’s modern football.

FS, it ain’t only Lurg mate, there are some others in here who “get it”.

On the bright side, we’ll bank a few mill more for next years books as a result of finishing 2nd
and bank the same amount as 08 for our run in the CL.

But at the end of the day, the sky isn’t falling…
FS and Lurg aren’t preaching doom and gloom, but they’re not stuffing their heads in’t sand neither!
What they are talking about is merely giving us a heads up on the weather forcast…
and that forecast is… its gloomy as fuck on the horizon.

The impending storm could blow itself out, or we might feel the full brunt should it make landfall! Either way… nice to have the heads up.

If we talk about unsustainable, it’s not LFC that’s unsustainable it’s the PL. 10 teams can’t afford to be in it and the other 10 are in copious amounts of debt.
.
Subsequently that’s why Real Madrid and Barcelona are spending 200 million pounds just to catch up with the big 4 in England. The top 4 teams in England are in the top 8 world wide.
.
Just to stay in that bunch we need to spend, I don’t agree with it but thats reality. Football is big money now.
.
I think one of our problems is our unrealistic outlook for players. We keep hearing about Silva, Spanish international. Even Balague claims he hot and cold, so reallistically he said we should aim for Juan MATA up and coming future international, has been more consistant this term. One’s about 25 while the other is about 12, it’s nice to spend like a galacticos but its just a bubble that’s going to burst.
.
As will the premier league eventually. Things go round in cycles, Italy was huge once, then it was Spain, now it’s England, who knows next it may be Germany.

In reality whether you want to think the worst or prefer to look at the best possible scenario or maybe even somewhere in the middle the business model that you acquire any loan for any leverage buyout still stands regardless of the world’s financial condition. H&G acquired the loan on the sound premise of a sleeping financial giant that has not been exploited (FS will love that word) to anywhere near is full potential.

We have over 40 thousand people on the waiting list for season tickets. The extra revenue that a new stadium will generate will be in excess of 50 million a year for match day tickets alone. This excludes merchandising, extra revenue via advertising etc. We will probably earn an extra 20 to 30 million for finishing second in the Prem as apposed to 4th then we will earn extra for a greater share in the CL revenue 35% for finishing second as apposed to 10% for finishing 4th and the list goes on as the commercial arm finally after the Moors and Parry ineptitude is swept out of the door. Just the announcements of the new commercial deal with various sponsors is proof of that and the profit generated after years of losses.

H& G are a lot of things but idiots they are not. They would not be throwing more and more of there own personal money, in the short term, as well as securing an extension by putting more of their own assets up as collateral. Without the new stadium they will loose big time and they know it. There are buyers out there bidding their time to see how H &G get out of their predicament. We will see an additional investor coming in or a total buyout within the next 6 to 12 months. The longer it takes the more a potential investor or buyer will have them by the balls. For H&G to want to sell their other sports franchises to fund LFC speaks volumes of the potential of our club and how it has been under sold and utilised all these years. We should in all reality be generating the same income as the Mancs and have a stadium to match given our success and popularity over the years.

You can make figures say all kinds of things, but the bottom line is, discounting the actual sale of the club we are a going concern where our revenue (no where near it’s full potential) is greater than it’s expenses and is growing in the right direction every year, both on and off the field. We are an outstanding and solid investment opportunity for the right purchaser who has the capital to invest instead of borrowing against. For example take Chelsea’s wage list at 172 mill per year as apposed to ours at 70 mill per year. They cannot even fill their existing stadium, who will buy that entity from the Russian. Our new stadium will take 7 to 8 years to repay just from the match day revenues then we will be worth over 1 billion. Rafa’s youth policy will save us millions in the transfer market for years to come and that will happen very soon know with Nemeth, Pacheo, Spearing, Ince, etc all coming through. Worried yes but only for how long H& G will try and hold on because they know the potential in the long run. Please do not get carried away, as with the transfer window in the silly season, with all the media hype.

Keith, you make a lot of sense.

My main worry is how long will H&G try to hang on and take out loan after loan until the stadium is built?

Obviously they bought the club to make big money and the stadium is key to that objective. But in order to build the stadium they will be putting the club into a huge amount of debt. That’s where the term ‘unsustainable’ comes in. The club can’t continue to take out a loan every 6 months until the new stadium starts generating the required cash surely? It looks to me like they will try to negotiate refinance every time a deadline looms and in the meantime hope that the financial/credit climate fixes itself so they can take out a further £300m loan to build the stadium. That’s a scary thought.

If we had owners who had the equity to invest in the stadium without having to borrow so much money I wouldn’t be too worried. However H&G seem unable to do that, their other companies won’t sell over night, and their attempts to find other minority investors have failed.

The mancs are in about £700m debt but their revenues comfortably meet the interest payments. Chelsea are in £800m debt but that debt is to their owner not any bank. Arsenal are in more debt than we are but like the mancs their revenues from the Emirates stadium can meet their payments.

It just goes to show how poorly run our club has been run that Chelsea turn over more revenue than us. It’s that poor running of the club that lead to a situation where David Moores hastily sold out to H&G in the first place. We were £80m in debt when the club was sold. The problems go further back than the American duo. Had our previous board had any modern sports business acumen and a pair of balls we wouldn’t be in this predicament. We’ve been talking about a new stadium since 1998. In that time a whole host of clubs have built stadiums. How is Sunderland able to build a 50,000 seater stadium in 1997 while we couldn’t?

Short of Money? The main site reports that we have made a £20m bid for Lavezzi!

I don’t think the transfer budget has been affected Steve. Remember these figures are up to July 2008 so directors within the club would have had the transfer budget sorted out well before the rest of the world were made aware of our financial position. Those figures were news to us, not news to the people inside Anfield.
£20m-£30m + revenue from player sales will probably be our budget. Despite the doom and gloom headlines suggesting we won’t be buying any players now with Rafa having to shelve his summer transfer plans.

Boro, Sland, Derby built decent size stadiums, how come Lpool can’t.Steve Morgan’s expertise should of been used.Groundshare with Everton is the only realistic option.Parry is a complete prat.Any chance of the Indian consortium buying?.

In that case, is it prudent to blow most of our dosh on one player? I know we need another striker, and I’m sure this lad is the Dog’s bollocks, but we all know that it is not the only area that needs improving. Having said that, of course, if you want a top Striker £20m is the going rate I suppose. Let’s see what develops from this “rumour”

What players will we be selling? Dossena and Babel perhaps? Anyone else?

LB ideally and before the markets crashed credit was a lot cheaper and easier to get. H&G would have taken out a building loan over the 7 to 8 years time frame depending on the Banks. This loan is normally rolled over until all the building works are completed and only then does the interest and the monthly repayment fees start. In that case the extra revenue generated would cover those cost, similar to Arsenals deal with the Emirates. They are creating lots of extra match day revenue but most of it is going towards the stadium repayment. They will benefit greatly when that loan is paid of in the next 7 odd years.

Our Muppets got the timing wrong, not to mention their figures on the initial loan otherwise they would have taken it out over a longer period, thus decreasing the repayments. However they where greedy and saw a great opportunity to make a killing, took out an expensive short term loan, thinking they would refinance later, when the markets crashed and the credit dried up they found themselves in shit scrambling for a buyer or another investor. Which still has to happen no matter how much bullshit is sprouted.

If we are bought outright like the Russian did Chelsea we would get the loan for the stadium over night. Why the borrowers cannot get the loan is because they cannot service the initial loan they took out to buy us in the first place and it will take time for the increase in advertising and merchandising to make up the slack. Defaulting in the States has not helped either, they are way over stretched. They also cannot afford to wait to long because as time goes by they have less room to manoeuvre hence they will be dealing from a very weak position. Both the Arabs and the Indians will take them to the cleaners if they become desperate. At some point the banks will force them to take any deal that covers their exposure, regardless of how much personal money they will loose. Banks will not care one iota as long as they are covered.

All the above in no way reflects badly on the potential and profitability of LFC as a long term excellent investment opportunity. We are and will remain a very good opportunity for the right investor. Hence my utter and complete disdain for what Parry has lumbered us with and by association Moors because ultimately stupidity is not an excuse and the buck stopped with him. However the prospects of us going into administration are very remote and I would probably have more chance of falling pregnant before that happens, but as the accountants always say never say never so yes there is always a chance of anything happening.

Good point LB.We were miles behind everybody else.I think we were caught up in the old “liverpool way” humble club,humble supporters,humble stadium.Whilst everybody was moving with the times we were still stuck in the 1980`s.

Don`t get me wrong nobody has a history,tradition and stadium like we do but football has dramatically changed in the last 15 years.Its a business now.So to keep up with your competitors we have to think like a business and we were slow on the uptake.

Lurgan i`ve read the clubs financial report (god is it long and boring) and we are really stuck between a rock and a hard place.

Basically the club(LFC) is making money and is a going concern but KHL is being crippled with the loans.They`re basically the same company when you look at it so whist KHL is in trouble then LFC are also.

If they don`t sell they will need to get investment from the outside for the staduim.I think Keith hit the nail on the head.H&G know that LFC has the potential to turnover as much as the mancs and madrid and are clinging on for a solution.

LB if dumb and dumber borrow the money, they will assume some sort of payback when they leave. If a sugar daddy comes in and builds us a stadium, he’ll want his money back when he leaves. So it doesn’t make any difference which way we go. A stadium is going to cost one way or another.
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Our problems have stemmed back for years. The problems we have now are because we never upgraded when it was needed.
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Moores gets away with all sorts of shit. He was the big Kahuna, he was a man without vision and now we’re paying the price. Morgan never stopped whining about him but most people thought Morgan was a cu++.
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I seem to remember Morgan bringing a debt problem to the table which was being covered over.
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I also heard a whisper that the loan has a 10% interest rate at the moment, but if we re-negotiate it could be around 3%, probably why there not that worried.
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Regardless of who owns our club, there in it for the money. DIC, Kuwait whoever, they are not going to give away their cash, they will want a return.
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Who’s to say there any better. Everyone we’ve been linked with has been raping the corporate world, and third world for that fact.
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We need to be someones toy, like a racehorse, funded for fun, but in the end we’re a business so we need to make money. I don’t see how the two can meet. So I just like to see a Red shirt running around Anfield week in week out.
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At this stage I would take the Columbian Cartel as long as they paid cash and if Fowler did manage us in the future he would not need to snort the white wash.

Jokes aside any billionaire ( not paper ones) with liquid cash available could make a very sound investment with huge long term returns if they want it or need it or if they just want the prestige of owning us there investment would be safe. The stadium will pay for itself so that is the least of our worries. For the 350 mill to 450 it would take to acquire us, depending how desperate the borrowers become with the increased revenue from a commercial aspect and with the stadium built and being self sustaining because of the increased match day revenue in 7 to 8 years we will be valued at way over 1 billion, if not 1 and ½ billion not a bad return on investment over that time period.

As another accountant has just come out and said the report was for the shareholders (H&G) and they would know the situation very well. They have three options, sell or bring in another investor, sell their other assets to bring down the debt and renegotiate the loan to make it sustainable or viable or three sell the players to bring down the loan. The last however is the least attractive, form a business perspective as it would lead to us missing out on CL qualification hence the whole financial cycle gets worse and the clubs value plummets.

Interesting times ahead and explains why H&G are trying to sell their other sports franchises.

Gaz if a Kuwaiti “sugar daddy comes in and gives them hypothetically £450 million to scoot and spent a further £300 million on the new stadium,they will have invested £750 million.They would probably have a ten year plan and the revenue a 70,000 seater stadium would bring in would be enough to pay them back and more as well as run the club to its full potential thus keep us competitve in the transfer market.

So i disagree when you say it makes no difference if they are bought out by kuwaiti`s or arabs or whoever.They are all in it to make money,we know that,H&G just done it arseways.

So Keith, help me to understand what’s likely to happen going forward… I’ve taken what you have said on board and am thinking of this possible scenario – correct me where I go wrong:

H&G ask for an extension of 6 months and tell the banks that in that time they will sell stakes in their other businesses or find other investors. Thus being in a position to pay off the loan or majority of the loan without having to refinance. I’m assuming the banks will sooner or later want this loan paid off once and for all rather than extensions or further loans being taken out over and over?

Timmy, yeah they did do it arseways. And they don’t have enough resources to take us forward.

Steve, regards to your point about spending our entire budget on one player. Maybe Rafa wants to get his main target first and then buy the cover players after he’s sold a few players. It seems he is willing to spend between £15m-£20m on a player that can play a few positions. Silva and Lavezzi can both play on either wing or behind the striker. In Lavezzi case he can also play as a main striker according to reports. Once he’s made that major signing he might not be in a rush to sign the back up right back or back up midfield player. He could afford to wait to sell Dossena, Babel, Voronin to bring in the extra £16m or so as the back up players are probably less sort after.

2 great posts in there Keith. Top drawer lad and really assuaged my fears. If we got Lavezzi i’d be even less fearful though! Hope its true…

You could well be right LB, but we can only guess at the amount Rafa will be given before he has to sell. If Lavezzi can offer that sort of flexibility accross the front line, then I can fully understand why Rafa wants him.

Yeah, it’s all guess work on my part Steve. But that’s what us fans do isn’t it? Especially in the summer.

Very good posts KeithSA. Very informative.

But i did not get one thing. You said the potential buyers need to fund the 400 or 450 mil to buy the club outright and the new stadium will ‘pay for itself’. How will that happen? I have read that we need something like 300 mil for a 60000 seater stadium. So, how will we be getting the money?

I feel any buyer who’s willing to buy us will be looking at a total investment of around 800 million. 400 to 450 for the takeover. Another 350 for a 60000 to 70000 capacity stadium. He will get his initial investment back only after, say, 10 years (assuming the club is footing 80mil a year). So he’s start making profit after 10 years. It’s a very long investment for anybody let alone the DIC.

Is my analysis wrong?

The transfer budget cannot be touched, or downgraded as the owners cannot interfere with Liverpool’s ability to compete in the CL… They’ve said it and there’s absolutely NO evidence supporting this theory…

From memory we’ve been spending about 28mill per season since H&G have arrived, which IS competitive. There should be every expectation that Rafa will get a similar amount this time around too (remembering that H&G NEED Rafa to continue improving/maintaining our league and CL position)…

A 20 mill striker/ Creative Midfielder, a 10mill RB and a cheap CB is very realistic as Rafa would surely be able to raise 2-5mill from sales… Not to mention the freedom from departing players salaries…

Nice posts there Keith, although I’m not happy about the debt, I do feel that we’re not as bad as many are making out. 18mill of that 40mill debt was spent on plans for Stanley Park, debt that won’t be there next year. Also, with more sponsors onboard and an Asian tour on the agenda we will have a further increase in revenue. A second place finish this season is also going to help swell the coffers, not to mention talk of naming rights for the new stadium… Revenue is on a marked incline, so you can feel as bad as you want about the present, the future is still looking positive, especially as the EPL is set to move into overdrive with the latest TV rights record…

It’s funny how people have slagged off our inability to spend big amounts of $$$ as we have been spending on a very competitive level: 18 mill on Mash, 20mill on Keane and Torres, 6 & 7 on Doss and Ninja Skirt, 11mil on Babel, etc…
I’m not defending H&G, ust that we seem to think that we’re hard done by when we’re not. To me Parry screwed us on many occaisions, Alves, Ronaldo and Vidic all being too expensive, dispite tripling their values since…

The future is still bright for LFC, we’ve got a strong “spine” and obssessed Manager and a backroom becomming littered with past Greats and proven performers…

YNWA

Lavezzi situation looks interesting… Looks as though the tabloids premise of Rafa’s lack of transfer $$$ has been shot down already…

That’s pretty logical LB as Rafa has always wanted to be able to sign his no1 target asap. It certainly appears Lavezzi is Rafa’s priority now that the agent is forcing Napoli’s hand…

By my reckoning Rafa should have around 8mill let to play with and if the silva rumours are correct them 8mill plus player(Benny or Babel?) may do the trick, like wise with Johnson- 8mill plus Crouch’s fee should also do the trick….

Interesting how Rafa recently sounded out Ngog for praise, seems as though he’s definately staying, as will Lucas…

my question is this: If we had signed Barry instead of Parry’s Keane would we have won the league? Bearing in mind that we struggled when Mash, Lucus and alonso were all out at the begining of the year….

Lancey, the thing is Rafa has had to do an awful lot of selling in order to spend those amounts. We are amongst the most supported teams in the world along with Barca, Real and Man Utd. Those 3 clubs do not have to flog 5 players before they can buy a couple of quality players. Forget those 3 look at Sunderland they haven’t had to sell any players, they gave Roy Keane a shit load of dough to splurge! And also Harry Redknapp didn’t have to worry about who to sell before splashing out £50m in January.

As for your question on Barry, if the club was run properly we’d have enough dough to buy both Keane AND Barry. You’d think a club of our size and aspirations for the season could afford to spend £30m net in a summer transfer window.

Abhiram,

Keith will surely answer this himself but i think when he said that the stadium will pay for itself he meant the extra revenue that it will bring will cover the costs of building the stadium.But it will take 8-10 years for the return.

This project will not be a quick fix for any potential buyers.

YNWAlancey,

I wouldn`t say £28m is competitive with the top clubs in Europe.Most of these clubs spend that alone on one player.We just depend on rafa to do his best with what he has.He has done pretty well considering the budget he has had.

Reading the clubs accounts i think they are allowing £21.3 million for player transfers.It was also mentioned that £12.8 million was recouped from the sale of finnan and keane july 31st 2008,the end of the financial year.A further £7 million was spent on riera and somebody else i can`t remember now.

So if Rafa is getting the balance he probably has £26 million plus player sales.

Rafa has been quoted as saying the following about Lavezzi:

“We never contacted Lavezzi and we have no intention of doing so. We want to put a stop to these rumours”.

Ahh well.

Keith, nice posts. Well argued and logical.
Rafa still has money to spend. Only thing is which player and for how much? THis is a fantastic chess game for Rafa. His moves are seldom perceived. When he makes the move, it will be an unexpected one. One needs to persuade other players to come to us because we have the realistic potential in the coming season to become Champions both in England and Europe.

No one has mentioned this before. Could there be a conspiracy theory going on then? Which Manager or team would want us to lose the confidence of players who might otherwise have signed for us? Does it not make Rafa’s life twice more difficult to convince players to come in when they read all the bad press out there? Could the press have been “persuaded and assisted” to slant it against us?

I heard a thing on BBC were they were talking about the global recession really hasnt hit the Premier League. One reason for that was that the TV rights have alreading been agreed upon and was possible acting as a buffer. The recession may not hit the EPL until its time to sign the new TV rights. The might be alot lower then they are now and I´m pretty sure that will make things alot tougher for everybody.

I just cannot understand why some people in here think The Fact that Liverpool FC’s “unsustainable” debts are media hype.

I don’t understand why people think the club’s creditors being worried that the club can no longer go on as it is as a “Going Concern” – is media hype.

And I certainly don’t understand why anyone thinks I’m kneejerking to that media hype.

And no disrespect to Keith or anyone else, but why are people still kidding themselves that we are somehow going to build a new stadium under H&G?

In fact, why does anyone believe H&G have, or are going to, put in any of their own money, when they haven’t put in one red cent up to now?

And while we’re busy playing fantasy football and picking our transfer targets for Rafa, does anybody in here realise that we haven’t even paid for Torres and Mascherano?

And I could go on, but I’d rather just say….

if this is all just media hype, why are SOS so worried about the ownership situation that they are now lobbying their members and all LFC supporters to contact RSB and their Members Of Parliament to stop H&G from renegotiating the loans – despite the damage that could do to the club?

Yes, it’s possible to sit and imagine all sorts of scenarios and outcomes, but why not face the facts and the current situation as it is at this moment?

Well, I just can’t be arsed going on about it anymore as I’m honestly tired of trying to get people to understand what dire straights we are in, only to be accused of over reacting to media hype, then having my posts pulled apart and scenarios made up to argue not only against my posts but the undeniable facts that we all already know.

The information is all out there. It’s easily looked up. There’s no need to imagine what could happen. There’s no need to come up with scenarios or summise anything. The facts are readily available and I just can’t be arsed trying to explain it anymore.

FS, I respect your opinion alot, but Crouch hasn’t even been paid for, it’s just the way of football transfers….

As for building the stadium, I thought Keith cleared that up- in short unless the crunch ends now so that the owners can refinance the stadium, well have new owners or part-owners…

Life goes on matey and Rafa’s not going to give up, so we shouldn’t either…

Somehow I cant see RBS taking anything, that SOS has to say, seriously anymore FS (that is if they ever did). Im sure you’ve seen the thread in the forums regarding the ‘Munich’ chants at an official SOS event. Bitterly bitterly disappointing. Let themselves, the club and all real fans down. Im guessing SOS’ moment in the sun is over and any national crediblity or support they’d garnered is irreparably damaged. ‘Mr. Hicks, Mr. Gillette, Welcome! Good news on your loan extension….’

So the problem is all out now.

Let’s assume that we have to consider bankruptcy.

Can anyone tell me if there is an equivalent of the US Chapter 11 proceedings in the UK. In Japan we call it a Civil Rehab proceeding.

The difference between a down-right insolvency where the company is ultimately liquidated and dissolved, that particular proceeding is provided to reset.

In the Chapter 11 proceedings, a secured creditor’s claim is automatically stayed. So even if the lenders had security over LFC or its assets (i.e., the players), the proceeding would disallow the creditors from executing their security interests.

In the Japanese civil rehab proceeding, unlike the US Chapter 11, a secured creditor can execute its security interest despite the commencement of the proceeding. However, what usually happens is that negotitation between the debtor and the secured creditor will evolve into an agreement to not exercise the security interest as long as the debtor continues to perform certain obligations. Moreover, the japanese system allows the rehab debtor to file for an extinguishment of the collateral if the court deems that the assets under the collateral/security is of significant importance to the operation of the debtor. In other words, the japanese civil rehab system is mega debtor-friendly.

In the case of LFC, the existence of players like sg or torres is vital, and the sale of them will be detrimental to the club in the long run because they are not easily irreplaceable.

So if this was Japan, I would not personally worry too much that the players themselves will be sold.

If I were the attorney for LFC in a civil rehab case, I would definitely claim to extinguish the collateral if the secured creditors play hardball.

My question is, what is the law like in the UK??

sorry, I meant to say, “players like SG and Torres are not easily replaceable”

New stadium is not the be all, end all of our financial problems.

Agree with others that our beloved club is trapped in a time warp.

Advertising opportunities, shirt sponsorship, player’s image rights etc. Everything needs to be brought up to date.

I honestly don’t post on here expecting all hands to agree with what I have to say, but FFS this is the equivalent of sticking your fingers in your ears, shouting la la la over and over again, while burying your head in the sand, and hanging a Do Not Disturb sign on your arse.

What the fuck does a few pissed up knobheads chanting about Munich have to do with the fact that the LFC Supporters Union is lobbying the RSB and Government ministers to not refinance H&G?

I’m not having a go at you personally Digger. It was just a very easy example to pick on.

The facts are out there, but it seems people in here would rather ignore them and conjure up their own scenarios.

And before I’m accused at having a go at Keith for that… Keith is one of the lads in here I have almost always agreed with. And, even when we are not in agreement, I still respect his opinions, his loyalty and his knowledge – which, as far as the financial shenanigans of the business world are concerned, is far superior to my own.

But this trust and apathy concerning our “Custodians” is totally beyond me. FFS It’s just came out this morning that H&G have paid themselves 2 million quid for travel expenses. And that’s just the latest revelation in a very long list of misdoings. But having said that, I’m now waiting for the next excuses for their blood sucking…..? Oh that’s normal practice. Oh it’s what everyone does. Oh it’s….

FFS The history of both these men shows over and over, that they will do absolutely nothing but bleed this club dry yet nobody seems one bit bothered that they are dragging this club into “Unsustainable debt” which will eventually leave it unable to operate as a “Going Concern.”
Not S*n headlines. Not Sly Sports News reporting. Not Talk Shite nonsense… the verdict of the creditors auditors.

The only facts I’ve seen so far in here…. YNWALancey – “We haven’t paid for Crouch yet.”

Well, whether we have or haven’t I don’t know. But, yes. He’s correct. This is the complicated nature of football transfers – spread out over a long series of complicated payments and repayments. And I’m sure Rafa will be able to buy some players over the coming weeks, but for how much longer will that be the case if H&G aren’t forced out of the club? How long will other football clubs – nevermind our creditors – keep accepting their promisary notes? How long before the banks will say enough’s enough, and call in the debt?

Well, the examples are out there all over the place for everyone to see. Small clubs are now being allowed to go to the wall without a second thought. But the examples of Leeds and Southampton can not be ignored. West Ham has just been taken over by the banks – Icelandic bloody banks that are at the hub of a lot of this so called “Credit Crunch.”

How did Leeds go bust? Oh yeah. That’s right. They over spent their income and carried on buying players, and paying wages, they couldn’t afford.

But LFC…. oh no. Not us. We’re going to find an altruistic LFC fan to buy a 40 odd percent share in the club for way over it’s full value, have no say in the running of the club or it’s finances, but pay off all the debt, magically appear a new stadium, and buy Silva, Johnson, Tevez and Uncle Tom Cobbley an all.

Since this came out, all I’ve tried to do is get people to face the facts – facts that are readily available…
Kop Football Holdings can not continue to operate in such a manner nevermind pay it’s debts.
Kop Football Holding has only one asset – LFC.

That’s exactly the same situation that unfolded at Southampton and West Ham, but all saying that has done is…. get me accused of over reacting to media hype, brought out “There’ll always be an LFC,” tubthumping, got fact replaced with possible imaginary scenarios, and – worst of all -even illicited excuses for H&G! Fuck me, what next.

This is isn’t about spreading doom and gloom. This certainly isn’t some knee jerk reaction to a report in The S*n or some such rag. I’m actually offended and baffled by the accusation. I know the scenarios and possible outcomes, but I also know the facts as they stand. I also know the facts doesn’t mean LFC are inevitably going to the wall. But fuck me, lads if this is the level of concern, well then, I’m honestly baffled by the attitude in here.

Well the fact that we haven’t been able to buy or sell one player is ample proof that the money just isn’t there.
Rafa stated so many times that we need to move fast, but nothing has been happening.

We’ve been in the deepest of shits since last summer.

Hyde mate, we will buy players. Don’t worry about that. It’s not really the point mate. The point is… we need to do everything possible to rid the club of H&G. The longer they stay, the more serious the problem will become.

And I know there’s very little any of us can do to get them out. I know that only makes it all the more depressing and makes people not want to face up to it. But we should all at least be aware of the problem and how bad it is.

Just clear up any misunderstanding we as fans have to accept that LFC is a business and anybody who puts the kind of money up to buy us will charge their expenses to the club. If you owned a business you would do exactly the same thing. To scream about their expenses misses the boat entirely and is only the fly in the ointment. This is not to say that I am any financial expert, if I was I would be sitting in the LFC Directors box instead of those two twats.

That they said they would not do a Glazer on us but went ahead and structured an offshore account to hold the majority of the debt whose only asset is LFC is semantics and the blame should be laid 100% at Parry’s and Moors feet for allowing it and signing off on it, plus the other shareholders because I did not see any of the minority shareholders questioning the deal, everybody was very keen to put the money in their pockets.

To get hysterical about an auditors internal report to the shareholders (H&G) who are already fully aware of the situation is also missing the point by miles. Just for the record I want these two wankers out as quickly as possible and agree with everything that FS is saying and going on about and anything we can do to speed up their departure the better, but we might just have to face up to the fact that they could be hear for the long run if they manage to sell their other assets, put additional funds into the loan while renegotiating it. I hope this dose not happen and we are sold outright, because if that is the case and we have decent, liquid owners we would fly and nobody would touch us for a very long time or un till we self destruct like we did 19 years ago and did not move with the times.

Firstly concerning the loss, it is actually sustainable if they manage to renegotiate the loan over a longer period and at better rates. We made a 10 mill operating profit last year. Next year we will receive 35% instead of 10% share of the CL TV revenue. The CL is worth roughly 45 odd mill, probably including match day tickets in that figure. Lets be conservative and say it will ad an extra 20 mill to the coffers. Let say we get an extra 10 mill for finishing second in the Prem instead of 4th, probably more and let say we increase our merchandising, advertising and revenue stream by an extra 10 mill, this figure will be probably more . That is already 40 mill extra, but they gave Rafa 20 mill to spend so that comes of the top so our losses are down to 21 mill for the year, excluding the cash injection and the lower renegotiated loan. As long as we maintain success on the field, 50 % share of CL goes to the Prem winners, plus bigger purse for the Prem winners and so on. The business model that is LFC is sustainable without the stadium. Yes purse strings will be tight until the stadium is built but it is not the dire warning of administration and liquidation everybody is talking about. However if we do not maintain the success on the field the whole house of cards comes toppling down. CL is an absolute minimum.

For my comment of the stadium being self funding, once we can safely cover the interest repayments as a going concern or the club is bought outright with no borrowed money to raise an extra 400 mill to build the stadium is a cake walk. The loan is a building loan, commercial property is normally over a 6 to 8 year period. The loan only becomes payable once the works have been completed and the extra money generated, firstly by the sale of the existing Anfield, plus naming right, plus corporate box sales and the extra money generated (50 mill or there about) by the increased capacity. So any investor that wants to buy us only has to look at the initial fee and not the combined fee that includes the stadium, they just have to have enough assets to stand surety for it. And if you are a billionaire you have got it or you are H& G all smoke and mirrors.

Agree with Fat Scouser.

Most people know that to borrow such vast sums to buy a club & expect fer it pay fer itself is a seriously dangerous route unless ye have some emergency stash to fall back on.

Like any other business (eg say a restaurant or a pub), the minute yer income dries up or ye hit a bad patch, yer F.O.O.K.E.D. Simple as. And in this economically parched climate . . .

Just because we’re LFC means we can escape the credit crunch & the inevitable consequences of bad debt. Ok, AIG got away with it. (But that’s typical innit?)

That’s why initially the DIC deal seemed better suited. Here were wealthy Arabs with plenty of backup reserves of oil money. While am sure they wanted to make a profit from running the club, one should realise that the super rich Arabs would not let LFC crumble whilst under their watch simply coz the creditors came a-calling. Its called FACE.

I was quite surprised to read in another blog/forum a few years back that many LFC supporters there prefered the Yanks buying than DIC.

Am sorry to say, there was more than a whiff of anti-Arab sentiment the way some of them were cheering the calvary riding into town.

All went silent when I asked on what basis did they think the Yanks would be better owners?

Am pretty fooking certain that if DIC had bought the club, we’d be watching footie in brand new stadia while the media reports on how the new onwers have managed to splash out on Benzema, Pato et al despite losing billions on oil prices.

Wishful thinking.

Anyways, me is very alarmed at the news. Although the report was for the previous financial year, you can see them two cunts digging an ever deeper hole fer the club.

As fer Rafa & the rest signing long term deals, so what? Them two cowboy fooks have shown to be very adept at making empty promises.

I certainly hope these two fooks’ other businesses concerns go belly up & will be forced to accept the next best reasonable offer that comes round fer LFC.

YNWA

“Just because we’re LFC means we can escape the credit crunch & the inevitable consequences of bad debt. Ok, AIG got away with it. (But that’s typical innit?)”

Sorry . . . meant to say, DOESN’T MEAN . . .

Rant over.

FS, I think we all realise we need to get rid of H&G ASAP the only difference of opinion I see here is the likely short/medium term future scenario of the club. There is no apathy towards H&G at all mate! 99% of us want them to fuck off. Now.

I sent 2 emails and a letter to RBS and sent a letter to my local MP using the SOS template. I don’t think it’ll make any difference but I did it anyway.

What I think will happen is that the bank give H&G an extension. The other scenario I think is realistic but unlikely is the banks force H&G to sell. What the more pessimistic fans think is that we might be put into administration if we can’t pay back the debt before 24th July. I think that is extremely unlikely and Keith has explained far better than I ever could what the reason for that opinion is.

During the 6 months extension my understanding is that they will desperately search for new investors or try to sell other assets in order to pay off the loan early next year. I hope that during this period they realise they are f*cked and have no choice but to sell.

As I mentioned yesterday my main worry is that they try to hang on for dear life taking out more and more credit until they find themselves in a position to build the stadium. FS, I don’t think any of us are living in a dream world regarding this stadium. But looking at it logically, it represents the only opportunity for H&G to make big money – which is the reason they bought the club in the first place.

Throughout all of this I’ve constantly said, this is what leads to administration. I haven’t said we will go into administration overnight, but if this situation continues it is the inevitable outcome.

I know fuck all about the financial world. I’m a simple fella. But if I go and take out a mortgage, and then I’m unable to keep up the repayments, the property will eventually be taken from me and my assets will be sold to pay my debts.

There’s no diference in this situation. It’s just that the property happens to be Anfield and the assests happen to be Torres and co.

The most probable or preferable outcome is open to debate, but that is the bottom line.

PS… Keith as predicted, someone said “Claiming expenses is normal practice.”

I’m just surprised it was you who said it. Of course it is normal practice mate. I wasn’t disputing that. I put it up as just the latest in a long line of H&G’s blood sucking.

2 million quid for how many appearances at matches?

Last week they done away with the Priority Match Ticket scheme. I just can’t be arsed writing out all what that entails and means. The bottom line is – fans getting fucked again. And even though both H&G have kept their heads down lately, this shit just keeps coming out week after week. What’s next?

Lads I don’t think anyone is burying their head in the sand, we all know things are tough, but until it changes that’s the way it is.
.
I prefer to take solace in the old LFC tradition or rising from the adversity. I have never known this club to do anything easy.
.
I know the boycott has been running and subsequently we’ve been protesting and other issues have been brought to the attention of RBS. Alas though their a bunch of dumb fucks who use copious amounts of public money just to make their own quids, no the fucking British Government is up to the eyeballs in this one.
.
Well lads I was in Sydney today on business and guess what I saw. Some old fella’s were having a kick in Hyde Park at lunchtime. One lad walking to the park from where ever he found parking. I noticed he had LFC shorts with LFC and badge, he had a wonderful set of blood red LFC socks. Alas though in sticking with the boycott he had a fucking England shirt on, but to make matters worse he had fucking Terry on the back.
.
I could have screamed, save the cash and spend it on a Chavs player. It’s getting harder by the day, especially when you want a Torres shirt.
.
Never mind if it’s hard for me it’s worse for the lads and Manager, so the best I can do is support the team. Afterall they gave everything they had this year.
.
Yes I know things can go tits up but we’re not going to get a fairy god-mother come in and make things right. Moores wouldn’t look right in a tu-tu. So I’m hanging in like most other fans.
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FS I know you see and here more than I could ever possibly do down here, but it’s time like this when we need people like you to show us how to believe.
.
Fuck I wish I could’ve headbutted that dickhead today. Not his socks or shorts of course.

One thing I would love to know is what these two toss-pots have done with the RBS 350m pound loan.

From what I’ve found, they paid about 220m for the club (175m for the club and the 45m of debt). Supposedly there is still 20m in the bank, 2m in their expenses (LOL), 18m to do perform analysis, yet again, for a new stadium – I wouldn’t be surprised if they had a holding in the company who done this as well.

I believe that the CL & EPL winnings and players sold, would account for, at least, the monies spent by Rafa (Parry) for new players during this time. So this still leaves 70m to be accounted for.

Conclusion, a pair of crooks – who will fuck anyone over to get money – who are not fit to represent and run our club.

Ahh, I feel slightly less ill now!

FS you and I are kindred spirits when it comes to LFC and I would proudly stand shoulder to shoulder with you in any battle that affects the club. However I know banks all too well they are the biggest whore masters in the business. Make no mistake they will make H & G put up more collateral (personal assets) or invest more of the own personal money to get the extension. They will make sure that their arses are covered 150%. This is two fold if they grant the extension under these conditions for another say 6 months, they will know that with the increased exposure the likelihood of G&H not selling the club or bringing in a investor goes down in proportion to their exposure, common sense the more you risk to loose the more you are willing to compromise. This is why the Indians and the Arabs are holding off to see how the Twats get out of it.

Make no mistake the Banks are there to make money and not to appease the fans, doubly so with all their loses they have made recently so if they see the financial gain in extending they will.

Personally I cannot see H&G getting out of it, especially Hicks because he is in a similar situation with all his other franchises, even if he manages to sell how much profit he will make is debatable. Their best bet from a business point of view, is to bring in an investor and retain a percentage, however if that happens (if somebody does not take them to the cleaners) they will loose control and that hopefully will be a good thing. I know I am more optimistic than not but I still see them getting forced out in the long run, unless they get lucky and negotiate a cheap long line of credit that in today’s market is extremely difficult.

Lurgan mate, to my knowledge, up to now they have spent over 30 million quid on the stadium. That has so far bought us 2 sets of drawings and a bit of fencing and a portaloo in Stanley Park.

KeithSA, I don’t want to piss on your chips but some of the figures you gave are not realistic/correct.

For a start the CL TV revenue is split by country and shared equally amongst the teams from that country, at least in the group stages. The total TV revenue for 07/08 was €277m and was distributed as follows:
- England 21%
- Italy 21%
- Germany 13%
- Spain 13%
- France 11%
- Scotland 2%

So I do not see this figure changing very much for the forthcoming season and there will definitely be no 20m increase.

Also, we will get nowhere near 10m quid more for finishing second this year. Each position is worth 761K, so we shall have an additional 1.522m in revenue for this in next years accounts – not even enough to cover their expenses.

BTW, we should earn just under £14.5m for finishing second. So already we reliant on increased advertising (which is a big unknown) to boost our revenue streams for next season.

I do understand what you are saying but for me the figures do not match up at the moment and probably will never do when these two leeches are at the helm.

FS so we are down to only ~60m unaccounted for.

As for the portaloo, we could save money by using the drawings as bog roll – how’s that for efficiency during the ‘credit crunch’?

As I said Keith, the eventual outcome is open to debate, but the fact that we are right at this moment deeper in the shite than all of us knew or expected is not.

I know we all knew how much debt we was in. I know we all knew when the next round of payments was due. But it is not business as usual.

We stand on the verge of really becoming a proper force in world football again. This may still be achieved in the short term. I do believe Rafa will be able to spend money and bring in players during the transfer season. I’m not worried that we haven’t done so yet. Except for Mercenary Citeh, who has?

What is really bothering me now is, the long term health of the club. As you yourself have just said… any possible investor will be sitting holding on to his cash in the hope all this goes tits up and they can then grab the club at the lowest possible price when the bank refuse any more extensions to the loan.

Will this be a good thing? Only time would tell.

But as I keep saying, the bottom line is we are headed in the same direction as Leeds, Southampton, West Ham and even Luton. Will it come to administration and all that entails? Well, maybe that would even be preferable to what we have now.

What’s the answer to this? I don’t know.

recycling at it’s best Lurgan mate. And let’s face it…. it’s about all they’re worth

Sharing a ground with Everton and selling the naming rights to the stadium is the only financially viable solution.In America large 20,000 indoor arenas are shared between Ice Hockey and Basketball teams and are rented out for concerts, wrestling etc.Way to go.Should of been done a decade ago.

Keith, you’re dead-right in everything you say about costing and expensing. This scare-mongering business about the expenses is total crap. There is no club-owner anywhere that charges the expenses himself. It’s completely naive to think that they were. It’s not the done thing in business. I’m no flag-waver for H&G, but I do recognize bandwagon demonizing when I see it.

Please. don’t anybody accuse me of siding with
them.

FS, I know where you are coming from, but it’s not going to be anything like what you say. We’re not going the way of Leeds and Southampton. You can’t compare your mortgage with a business loan. They’re very different mate. Liverpool is a profit-making asset – where as your gaff doesn’t make any money at all. In fact it’s a liability, as it takes money out of your pocket. Even if RBS really nail G&H, they still know that there is a cash-flow that is keeping things afloat.

As for the stadium, it’s actually a bit of a blessing in disguise. If we would have steamed ahead with building the stadium, we would have been raped with the building cost. It will now be a case that a proper cost will be negotiated – which will benefit the club. This is probably not any great foresight on the owners part, but to they’re credit, I’m sure they got a good sense of what might be coming. But no owner would have been able to build the stadium with the way purse strings have been tightened by the banks. I think we really dodged a financial bullet by having the work put off.

Demonizing! Scare mongering! No one expects H&G to pick up the expenses for their jollies. Nobody said they should. The point was…. 2 million quid for how many trips to the match?

Do you realise when you come to Anfield, you won’t even be able to visit and have a pint in The Sandon on matchdays? Maybe some of you don’t even know the relevance of going to that pub. But even if you do, you won’t get in there on a match day, because Mr. O’Hicks has commandered it for himself, his family and other’s on coprporate jollies. Why is that relevant? Look it up, eh. Demonising me arse. He made a fine job of that himself.

FFS. I give in.

But I was about to say this, so I’ll say it anyway…

Ground share will never happen. I actually agree that it makes a lot of sense in a lot of ways, but it won’t happen.

As for the New Stadium blessing in disguise or as us realists call it a Downright Lie…

Last season, I was up in Liverpool about a month after H&G announced building had started on the New Stadium. I was on a bit of business, but Missus FS decided to come with me to visit family and friends, and wanting to do a bit of shopping and them things birds do.

I only had the one day when I was able to visit “The New Stadium.” So she ended up getting dragged along. It was absolutely pissing down with rain that day, and all the streets in and around the site of the New Stadium were closed due to roadworks. So, I marched her about 3/4 of a mile through a monsoon to get there.

Nevermind my face, you should have seen hers when we finally got there and seen the New Stadium, the work in progress and the workforce… an aul fella of about 70 odd, trying to shelter from the rain behind about 12 pieces of wire fencing, and a portaloo.

Fucking comical really. And if it wasn’t for the fact that it is LFC that he is fucking I would take my hat off to Tom Hicks, conman extraordinaire – who does seem able to con a lot of the people all of the time.

No FS, I meant that the stadium *not* going ahead is a blessing in disguise. I’m not going t oget into a position of seeming to defend G&H, but I do care about not getting caught up is a maelstrom torch-burning.

And as far as I’m aware, building was never said to have been started. I read constantly that it was “preparatory work”. Which could mean anything.

Isn’t it better – with hindsight – that we are going to pay less for the stadium when it eventually gets going?

FS, agree with you that the two yanks ought to be hanged. They are the ones causing us this misery. Next is Moores and then Prick Parry. Mile high strategic mistakes to pick H&G instead of the well proposed and argued DIC. Arghh. Only ting is that’s already history.

The truth could be more towards what Keith had commented on so ably (IMHO) and the way you go out painting “LFC are truly in the deep shit and don’t you tell me otherwise”. I do not like the red ink, but things are not that stark bad. I love reading your writings. Still do. We are on the verge of something great. I do think there is some bigger masterplan to undermine us. The stakes are too big in the premier League. I still trust in Rafa. What a Manager wwe have. Chin up, FS mate. Cheers.

Demonising? Scare mongering? Maelstrom of torch burning?

FFS. This man came in the 11th hour of the 11th hour at the behest of his business partner. Since that moment, he has not only completely fucked his partner, he has constantly fucked us, never put in one red cent of his own money and pulled 30 million quid strokes such as “Preparatory work.”

And that’s not even scratching the surface of what this man has done since taking over our club. It’s not even mentioning his other business activities or his history in general businesses or sports “Franchises.”

But just by discussing what the man’s creditors auditors have said about him – and it’s possible/inevitable outcome unless things are changed – I am igniting a maelstrom of torch burning and my thoughts are demonising and scare mongering.

For somebody who doesn’t want to defend this individual you are certainly attacking those who are exposing what he’s done… No. Not me. The auditor’s, the creditors, the supporters union, etc.

The simplest way I could think putting this, has even been attacked.

But someone please explain to me, why this is any different than me buying a property and not being able to meet the payments?

And please take into mind that there are such things as taking out mortgages on business and investment properties. You know, like Anfield.

And can someone please explain to me how spending 30 million quid on a bit of fencing and a few drawings – of something that was never going to happen – is a blessing in disguise?

Could you also please explain why our parent company not being able to meet it’s liabilites is any different than Southampton’s parent company not being able to meet theirs?

And please explain to me why Leeds buying players and paying them wages that they couldn’t afford was any different to us doing it?

Oh and please explain to me why banks have took control of West Ham because they couldn’t pay their debts but won’t do this to us?

And I could go on, but the fact is, I’d could go on and on and on in here, running around in circles till I disappeared up my own arse and someone would still say “It’s just normal practice.”

Knight my friend, if you read the comments you will see that all I have done is state fact. I haven’t came up with any scenarios. I have just qouted responsible organisations on the facts as they have reported them.

Since then, practically every comment has been to dismiss what I have said. What am I supposed to do? Lay down and ask for forgivness. I think not my friend.

I haven’t spread doom or gloom. I haven’t been scare mongering. I haven’t even said what I think the outcome of all this will be. I have simply said what has been said by the creditor’s auditors and yes… I have then said what has happened in previous situtations like this with other clubs. But I have also said, that doesn’t mean it’s inevitable it will happen to us. Far from it.

But if everyone in here wants to pull apart my posts and even put words in my mouth and accuse me of saying things I haven’t, I will not lay down and agree with them for an easy ride. Surely you know me better than that by now. I have never done that in me life. I never will. In here or anywhere else, including out in the real world. But I am becoming used to it in here. Even when I state the bleeding obvious – something like we need cover for Arby, that being the last example – people decide to attack the statement, despite the facts, and a coupld of days usually passes before we move onto the next example.

Tiring and boring to say the least.

Well, I’m going to take me wee dog for a walk down by the river now and thankfully it looks like it’s about to rain… nipping into the pub for a few pints will clear me head better than this!

FS, great article about Rafa and his convictions in The Liverpool Echo:http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/liverpool-fc/liverpool-fc-news/2009/06/09/i-ll-fight-every-inch-of-way-to-make-liverpool-fc-champions-rafa-benitez-100252-23822854/

FS, I just had half a pint in me house!

FS, Do enjoy yourself. Cheers, mate.

Nice set you got here Gerry.Once again it feels great to be back.Work sucks.

I am with FS, tweedle dum and tweedle dee are a bunch of morons that didn’t live up to their promises. We needed an investor then, but we need a Saviour now. If the papers are to be believed, then it was Parry’s advice that Moores should sell to the yanks and not the arabs. Parry got the ball rolling.

H&G has done nothing but lied to us since day one. The thing is this, if we build the stadium, we would be digging ourselves deeper into debt, but if we don’t, we can compete with the rest of the big teams. Between the devil and the deep blue.

Whoever said that it was normal practice to charge personal expenses to the company…well I think you’ll make a good politician.

The fact that the auditors,KPMG, are one of the big 4 audit firms in the world, and are coming out with statements such as the club’s parent company won’t be a going concern is a real worry to me, and I feel all Liverpool fans too. Not being able to be a going concern means that the company won’t be able to survive and high likelihood that it will even be liquidated in the foreseeable future.Audit firms such as KPMG will never come out with such a statement unless they truly believe it to be. Because if they do,and the company continues as a going concern in the foreseeable future, the company can sue the auditors. But I tend to believe the auditors if it is in fact what they said, as reported in the papers, because as I said this is KPMG’s report, not Joe Nobody & Assocs audit firm. KPMG will have a lot to lose if they are not careful with what they say.

I doubt that the banks will lend H&G any extension because of the current economic environment. First of all H&G aren’t good borrowers, in the sense that they are struggling to even to make interest payments, and because of this even if the banks were to allow an extension to the loan, it will cause the interest payable to increase. This happens due to credit default risk that the banks will try to minimise.

The best solution would be for H&G to sell up, and try to work out with the potential new owners, hopefully it is the DIC, about how to value the debts of the club.

But any whos, we should be prepared to face a turbulent year ahead, financial wise.

Just my two cents worth.

Sorry meant to say we can’t compete with the rest of the big teams……

Just heard Setanta are going tits up, how much do they pay the clubs?
i know the SPL will be the biggest losers but it will affect us the same .
Groundshare !! do you want a blindfold and a last ciggie when you stand
against the wall Burgerman.
W.Ham bailed out by the Icelandic banks the same banks the British Gov
bailed out last year,similar to RBS who we’re in hock to.
On the Transfer front it looks like we wont be signing Barry,Johnson,Teves
Villa,Lavezzi so that leaves Silva from our wishlist,lets hope Rafa as more
luck with his targets as he wont have more money.
YNWA

Crouch returning to Anfield? Stranger things could happen. He may be ideal pairing for Torres (in a 2-1-3-4 formation) or as a back up. http://www.lfconline.com/news/loadnews.asp?cid=TMNW&read=2009SOO0607126234&id=449862

Rome, Setanta pay the Premier League and the PL pay the clubs. Setanta have a £35m payment to make to the PL on June 15th. The PL say they have a water tight contract. ESPN are favourites to buy the rights off Setanta for next season.

There goes my subscription to LFCTV then. I shall be cancelling my Setanta direct debit tonight.

If SkySports went tits up the PL clubs would be screwed!

As I said in my previous post unless an out-of-court refinancing is agreed upon, the only option to save the club from being liquidated (i.e., have our best players sold) by the secured creditors is through a court procedure.

However, filing for such a restructuring procedure (if one does exist in the UK) may be detrimental to our existence in the Premierleague.

I do not know what the exact requirements are, but if a club were to file for a Chapter 11-like proceeding, our premiership status may be taken away.

On a different note, regardless of whether a court procedure is filed, the secured creditors themselves will look to maximize the value of the assets subject to the security interest.

I think with a football club, especially the calibre of liverpool, the only way to maximize the value is to actually sell the entire club intact rather than sell the each component asset piece by piece.

So in a sense, that my expedite the ousting of the two shitheads.

In any event, it is worrying; I am really concerned that Rafa may walk.

What a shithole we are in. And LB is right; the current 2 dicks are bad enough, but Prick parry and moron moores are just as to blame. What useless piece of shites they were to sell their shares without conducting any due diligence on their part.

Well, I didn’t bother with the pint. The alehouse was empty and I couldn’t be bothered standing about drinking on me own. The Great British Boozer, just another casualty of the so called credit crunch.

But I did have a nice long walk and cleared me head, but sadly it just kept coming back to the same thing…. we – the supporters and fans of LFC – are every bit as much to blame for this sorry state of affairs as are Parry and Moores.

That might seem a bit harsh, but it’s true. When H&G rode into town we were all more than willing to welcome them with open arms and, sadly, legs. And none of us bothered to really question anything even when they set about fucking us.

In fact, lots of us stuck by them and even blamed Rafa for sowing discontent when he was warning of us of what was going on the background. And even now, when all this is out in the open, some of us prefer to defend them than face facts.

Well, I for one, think it’s time for that to stop and by that I mean completely stop. Even if we buy Snoogy Doogy in this transfer window, we shouldn’t drop our guard or let them off the hook.

I know all you lads to a man realise that they are the enemy within. I know all you lads can’t wait to see the back of them. And I know there is actually very little we can do to oust them. But there’s a qoute floating around a lot lately…
“For evil to succeed all it takes is for good men to do nothing.”

I hate to say that. It’s a bit too dramatic for my liking, and there’s much more important things going on in the world than 2 greedy venture capitalists ripping off some football club. There’s real proper evil and misery in this world that we can do nothing about.

But having said that, this is important to us and I have a feeling a new round of protests and actions will soon surface. In fact, that’s inevitable. And when they do, we should act upon them.

But I don’t expect anyone to do anything they don’t agree with. I never came in here asking anybody to join the SOS campaign to deny H&G refinancing. That would be wrong, as lots of people don’t agree with this action as it could have very harmful effects on the club. So, act according to your own convictions but don’t forget who the real enemy is. And hopefully the next round of actions against our “Custodians” will not be ones that can hurt the club.

Having said all that… I hope Keith is right and everything turns out for the best. In fact, if you read my posts I’ve never even said we are doomed to administration and all the penalties that bears. Far from it. I’ve even asked if this is the best thing that could have happened for the club, because at the end of the day – anything that rids us of these parasites can’t be all bad.

And hopefully that’s my last word on it until they are nothing but a bitter memory.

FS, It is not truew that we did nothing. If you remember, suing this Kopblog website, we did persuade everyone to sign up and petition H&G. Separately we organised and pelted them with e-mails directly to their PR agents or something. I believe it was Alex who created the petition for all of us to sign. And the fans had banners saying “Thanks but no Yanks” and sang rafa’s songs when he was hurt by H&G.
We then wrote tonnes of stoires abt how they deluded us and cheated us , promising this and that but never delivered. I do not recall anyone here who had a good word for them and chastised Rafa instead.
You should have had your pint in the pub to clear your head… haha

We sure did welcome them with open arms FS. But should we know any better? I guess we trusted the judgement of Parry and Moores. They were looking for investment for 6 years or so. They pulled the rug on DIC and went with H&G. I took this as a sign that they were being very careful in who they selected to take over our club. I think we all did. We were entitled to assume that Parry and Moores carried out a thorough due diligence before selling the club. Assumption on this occasion was the mother of all fuck ups.

Knight mate, you’ve missed what I said… We done nothing but welcome them with open arms.

I didn’t say we done nothing at all. In fact, I was quite proud that it was one of our members, Alec, who came up with the kit boycott petition and I spread it around every LFC organisation I could.

But having said that, some of us did carry on doing nothing and some of us did (and still do) defend this pair of shysters.

For example, we as fans shouldn’t be saying “It’s normal business practice.”

We should be asking why 2 million pounds has been taken from the club’s earnings to pay for H&G to come to attend how many of our matches?

As I said, before I hope this is my final word on this. And I’m honestly not being stroppy mate, but please read them properly if you are going to pull me up on them.

And I stand by what I said…. when H&G rode into town, we done nothing but welcome them. When things started to go a bit pear shaped some of us defended them and did indeed say Rafa should just shut up and stop spreading discontent.

And, despite all we have learned about this pair of shysters since they arrived, some of us are still making excuses for them – which in my book is no different than defending them.

LB, I honestly hate to say this, as I’m honestly not trying to be a smart arse or make meself look clever. But at the time when they took over, I did say I had doubts. But that was only because I had worked for mega-rich venture capitalists in America and therefore I knew what they was like, and so knew all that scarf waving and protecting the club values was just PR bullshit.

But having said that, I didn’t complain about it. Like everyone else, I was just happy to believe that we would get the backing we needed and so desperately wanted.

And yes. You’re right most/all of us believed in Parry and Moores but we still fell for it. And believe me I hate to say this, but when the GLazier’s arrived at Old Trafford, at least some of them had the sense to know what it entailed and so try to stop it. Us, we just laughed at them and then, even with the hindsight of their experience, we still bent over for H&G.

Shameful really.

You can tell I’ve got bugger all to do today again. But a mad thoughts just came to me… Our Americans will know more about this than me, but when the shit was hitting the fan at the Texas Rangers, Tom Hicks went out and bought them A-Rod, Alex Rodrigez.

I think this was the biggest ever deal in Baseball. I’m not sure. But from the little I do know, in America this was thought to be Hicks acting on his ego and saying fuck you to all the people that was questioning his motives and running of the club.

Be funny in a grim sort of way, if, after all this, the fat twat gave Rafa the money to go out and buy anyone he wanted.

RAFA BENITEZ today insisted he has got enough cash to splash to turn Liverpool into Premier League champions.

The Reds’ summer spending is expected to be dwarfed by a number of their rivals but the Spaniard is in fighting mood – and confident he will land his main transfer targets.

“We knew it could be difficult because there is a crisis all around the world,” he said.

“Clearly we don’t have too much to spend but I think we have enough money to add the one or two players that we need.

“I’m very happy with the squad we’ve got.

“This season has been really good and we’ve competed on all fronts.

“If we can sign one or two players then I’m really positive that we can improve.”

Benitez, who signed a new five-year contract back in March, will celebrate five years as Liverpool manager next week.

He admits he is relishing the challenge of taking the club to the next level.

“When I decided to sign a new contract I did it because Liverpool Football Club is more than a club,” he said.

“It is the heart of the city. It is our life and for the people here it means so much.

“I thought I had to sign. We have to fight. We have to do it.”

More from Rafa:

“The people in this city are always fighting and have been fighting all their lives. We want to do the same.

“We know the situation is not fantastic but I have a lot of confidence in our squad and we want to fight like we did this year.”

“It has been a terrific season for us,” he said.

“We came very close and we were competing on all fronts. We want to repeat the same next season.

“I won’t talk about any figures and I can’t say how much we have.

“If we can sign one or two players then I’m really positive that we can improve.”

“I’m also positive because we were talking recently about how Fernando Torres and Steven Gerrard didn’t play together for a long time this season,” he added.

“Hopefully they will play together more next season.

“We’ve also got good young players like David Ngog, Nabil El Zhar, Ryan Babel and Emiliano Insua, who was playing really well, coming through.

“We have a very good squad but we can still improve a little bit.

“How much can we improve? Enough to the win the title? I’m sure it will be enough to compete.

“Like this year we will try to compete on all fronts until the end.”

“Clearly we knew the situation in the world would be difficult this summer,” he said.

“Some clubs were asking for our players so the priority was to extend the contracts of our key players. Those players who are the spine of the team.

“We spent some money to guarantee this and now we just have to improve a little bit because we are in a very good position.”

Benitez will celebrate five years in the Anfield hotseat next week and he admits the support of the fans continues to inspire him.

“Every single year, every single week and every single day when you talk with a fan he is supporting you and supporting the team,” he said.

“You can see the passion and it makes a massive difference.

“This city has passion. When we talk about Evertonians they have passion for their club that is really good.

“Our fans are amazing and when I talk with people in Spain they all say the same.

“We will see it again when we go to Asia in pre-season.

“I receive a lot of letters from people talking about the club. And as I said before this is more than a club. It is the heart of the city.”

Please don’t start going on at me about this that and the other….
“Clearly we don’t have too much to spend but I think we have enough money to add the one or two players that we need.

“I’m very happy with the squad we’ve got.

There it is in black and white from the horse’s mouth.

Holy Shit, I’m missing all the good stuff here. I hate it when work gets in the way of my following LFC!

A couple of points though…

1. A few people have stated now that G&H will be forced to put more of their own money into the club!
That would be grat… except they haven’t put ANY of their own mney into the club.
The first loan was entirely financed and unsecured.
In order to secure the refinance, they had to put up 20 mill each in collateral. But all that meant was that they had to bank that amount in the Caymans to show they had it. The moment the loan was signed, they could (and I’m sure did) pull that money.

2. Back around the time of the refinancing, an audit was done and very little reporting got done on it, but Tony Barrett wrote an article that suggested there was 40 million missing from the figures… unaccounted for?

3. All players purchased thus far under G&H were purchased with borrowed monies, not money they put into the club. (Some of ytou will want to argue that point and I’m sorry for not providing evidence, but I don’t stock[ile articles for later evidence, I just have a decent fuckin memory.)

4. 30 mill spent on a portaloo, some fencing and building plans (fuckin ‘ell I guess I should become an architect… 30 mill for drawings???) could have bought us Tevez, Silva, “Insert player of choice here”! … something that would have done us some good instead of a spade and a fence.

5. Well, they’re just cunts! (sorry had to get that in there.)

6. This idea that G&H are morons. Its got to stop. They are fuckin smart businessmen and would have fucked off with a massive profit if not for the recession. That is what has them stumbling. Their business model was the same as everyone elses over the last 8 years. Buy low, sell high at inflated prices!
Make no mistake, these two will walk away at some point an none of the mess will stick to them.
Kop Holdings is based and registered in the Caymens. = They can fuck off when they want to and no U.K. or U.S. laws can touch them.

People spent 8 years calling Bush and Cheney moronic dickheads… only now is the true and real extent of just how much money (billions $) got handed out to Texas based cntractors starting to surface. Nothing stupid about that. Obscene maybe? Illegal definitely. But not moronic!

What does that have to do with G&H? The UK based architectural firm that drew up the original plans for 2 mill, was replaced by a US based company who were then given an additional 28 million… to simply make tweaks to the original design???????

7. If people have stopped going the pub… they’ll stop spending on match tics, and satellite tv, and merch… all of which will decrease revenue.

8. Any high profile players brought in will likely be getting higher wages that any player we might sell… thereby increasing our expenses.

9. 2009′s reports will include severance pay for all the backroom lads Rafa just shunted… and their replacements may well be costing us more in wages?

10. aw fuck it… as FS said I can’t be arsed going on.
But hey, not to worry. Everything will be alright!

Aitch in number 4 you forgot the aul fellas wages and the cost of his spade.

A note to all the cork lads….

A friend of mine is a proprietor of Brannigans pub in pine street in cork.This pub(which was called nevada smiths until recently) is a fairly big liverpool pub in cork.

He has secured the services of Ronnie Whealan for a question and answer session in the bar on friday 26th of june.Tickets are twenty euro.

I don`t know if any of ye are interested but i just thought i`d let ye know.

FS, I think you’ll find that even if all of us could have predicted what G&H would do, not one of us would have been able to stop Moores picking up his 30 pieces of silver (or in this case, an extra 8 million quid!) Sorry buddy, but if you think this is scapegoat time, Moores is the man you should be pointing the finger squarely at!

Ever so squarely!

Don’t get it Steve? Scapegoating? Who’s scapegoating? If you mean that I blame all of us for our predicament then yeah, what’s wrong with/about that?

It’s okay pointing fingers at Moores ( who obviously carries more blame than most) but you might aswell blame the national lottery for being invented, fucking up the pools and so diminishing Moores fortune and forcing him to sell.

By saying we are all to blame, I’m just pointing out the fact that we were all hoodwinked. I happen to believe Moores was also conned. I know the man must feel awful about what happened, but I also know his 3 pieces of silver (or 90 million quid) eases an awful lot of guilt and regret.

But when it comes down to it, there is one villian in this piece that stands head and shoulders above any one else – Tom O’Hicks.

But that doesn’t mean I’m giving a walk over to George Gillette or anyone else involved in this debacle – including us fans. And yes we were conned but not one of us seems to have taken time to do any research on Hicks or Gillette but one of our favourite pastimes seems to be shouting Google Search at Parry and Moores.

And it seems hindsight isn’t always 20/20 after all, eh.

I think that as a general rule you should never trust anyone who is called junior or has called their offspring junior. H&G is guilty on both counts.

Is it only me who thinks that it is not right to call your son, whatever junior…

Puts the fucker right in his place, no?

In a bad mood today!

The more I research Hicks the more angry I get that the club was sold to him in the first place. A simple google search confirms that this man is a total cunt yet he managed to con his way in.

I was just reading an old blog from Gerry, July 2008. “How guilty is David Moores”.

Lurgankop the 3rd.

Cheers for the heads-up Timmy. I wonder if they would charge e20 a pop and I’ll host a Q&A ? You might run it by your buddy ? !

Just been listening to Off-The-Ball / Sid Lowe and they are punting “Mascher to Barca” big time. Seems like agent tapping up time again.

There’s sharks in them there waters, hanging with the big boys.

I see out of the corner of my eye a big pie coming at me courtesy of FS and Gerry and all wise sceptics so I’ll shut up.

Moving onto messrs Parry and Moores. Am I to believe that these two (respected business people???) did not have the intelligence to perform a due diligence of their own on these American shysters, on behalf of their shareholders and clients (i.e. us)?

I don’t know what Parry’s input was but the final decision was from Mr Moores. I am not sure how he got to be chairman for so long but I have the feeling if he fell into a pool of tits he would come out sucking his thumb!

The whole story is just indicative of what a shabby outfit we have been for the last 15 years or so, from top to bottom, until Rafa arrived.

Ref. Ezekiel 25:17. Amen!

LB #147, made me laugh. Now the wife is wondering what I am doing on this laptop. Bit on the side???

You’re going to get me into trouble

Dougle mate, the Masch story has been lingering about for a while. It was always a case of who was going to splash the headlines first. The transfer window isn’t even officially open yet, but be warned…. brace yourselves for story after story of this shite now as the “Unsustainable” story really starts to bite.

Funniest things I’ve heard in the last two days, both exclusives on Talk Shite, both screamed out of the radio only to quietly be ignored as if they never happened once they had been shown up to be total bollacks…
Monday: Tevez has signed for Man City – reported as absolute gospel truth because they had been told by a “source.”
Today: England will play it’s game against Andorra because of the tube strike in London – nevermind the fact that 80,000 tickets had been sold for the game. It was reported again as gospel because it had been told to them by a “Source.”

Seems to me some fucker had been on the sauce if they believed that shite, but not once did they recan’t any of it and appologise for the duff info. They just plodded along as if nothing had happened. Can’t wait for tommorows Source, but I think it will be hard to top them two. There again, the British media…. Rafa ate my Hamster, anyone?

Here’s a link from Sunday, didn’t want to post it. Believe it or not, scare mongering isn’t my aim. But I must admit, I had a sneaky moment when I felt like posting it just to see what panic would ensue….
ttp://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1191317/Rafas-title-dream-looks-Liverpools-massive-debts.html#

Last one before I go…. Marcia the Spanish rag, has now reported that Silva has joined Real. He may well do in the end, but he hasn’t yet and I’ve already seen fellas on other sites ready to slit their wrists at this “exclusive.”

Oh well, if nothing else our inactivity in the un-opened market place and the screams it causes should be good for a laugh if nothing else.

Night night.

Well, I suppose none of us are in the best of moods today. Point taken FS, but (and I know wev’e been over this ground several times before)it wasn’t us supporters who sold our soul to the highest bidder. Don’t get me wrong, Parry was just as guilty as Moores, but at the end of the day Moores was the shareholder and failed to do the necessary homework on this pair of cunts.

I’m sure none of us feel good about blaming anyone for this. What’s done is done and we can only hope that new buyers come in and invest in the club in the correct manner.

Like alot of you lads have said, a savvy investor will get their money back in the long term by doing things properly. Let’s hope for that, ASAP!

Hopefully the pic of John Barnes and the subject matter convinces your wife that you’re being good.

As for due diligence. The only due diligence they did with Hicks was “£88m hmmm, sounds better than £80m we’ll take it!”

Moores got an extra £8m and then kept on as a paid non-executive director. Parry got a £1m bonus and kept on as CEO with a 2 year notice period should they want to sack him. I don’t believe there were such assurances if they sold to DIC. As far as I’m concerned that’s the due diligence they undertook.

The Daily Mail will have us selling Gerrard to Burnley next.

Ooops, should say England will play it’s game against Andorra behind closed doors because of the tube strike.

Yeah. Straight up, just because someone phoned them and said it, them twats honestly believed and reported that the international game would be played to an empty stadium and all money spent on tickets etc would be rfunded, because of a fucking tube strike – no matter that 80,000 tickets had been sold and the fact that Wembley is so in debt it will probably be followed by the monster truck fest or some such shite, straight after the game.

The mind really does boggle.

Spain won 6-0 against Azabaijan. Villa hatrick, Torres, Riera, Guiza.

I thought that was hilarious as well FS as if getting to Wembley is only possible by tube. By the way talk sport(trades description act) were talking about Tevez I thought it was already a done deal. They are a shocking outfit, I don’t why I listen to such crap.

Keith seemed to make a lot of sense but we are only a viable proposition as long as we keep doing well on the pitch ie champions league qualification at the very least and 1st or 2nd in the league. As soon as we stop making money to service our debt that’s when we will go the way of Leeds.

will my avatar come out? The suspense is killing me…

no it didn’t what the hell is going on?

LB, unfortunately what you say in #153 (not the one about Barnes ) is probably true.

I ask myself time and time again, if I was in the same position would I have done the same as Moores et al and I still come up with the answer, no.

What’s the difference in having 40m, 50m, 70m, or 200m, we all die in the end anyway and you can’t bring it with you.

I used to have respect for Moores but he, himself, has sold his soul to the Hicks!!!

Is right Steve, that’s why I don’t really defend him. I just say it as I see it – Moores is guilty of no more than being an absolute tit-head, but for that he deserves all the stick he gets. And LB mate, you forgot the bright fire engine red matching Ferrari’s him and Coco got.

Now shut up you’re being very naughty and I need to fuck off.

Loving that avatar Kenny

Doesn’t look good

ww.guardian.co.uk/football/2009/jun/09/liverpool-tom-hicks-george-gillett

Lurgan, there is a difference between £40m and £200m. With the latter you can get your own yacht, private jet and helicopter. With the former one has to just content himself with a Ferrari and house in Mossley Hill.

Kenny’s attempts at an avatar remind me of some of the Robbie Keane finishing in a red shirt….

LB: No need for that. You lads are in for atreat if I finally manage it.

Lol

this is doing me head in

Robbie Keane!

But seriously though, I know that we, as fans, should share the blame, but the thing is, whatever we had done, I reckon Moores would have sold his shares to the Americans anyway. And I have a feeling that the option of selling to DIC would not have been any better. I mean, at least with the Americans, we know that they move by a written agreement, but with the Arabs– well, they completely ignore anything that is written down!

The sad truth is, unless you have a single billionare like Abramovic who just adores liverpool as much as we do and does not really care about making profit or not, we would have at some point been in deep shit under the current credit crunch.

Had we had more vision back in the early 90s when we were still afresh with the memories of our last win, and had marketed the brand more instead of sitting proudly, I think we would have had a better starting point.

There are many things to blame, I know, but there’s no doubt about it– the recent events have shown who is the biggest to blame.

I think the butler did it.

… or maybe Colonel Mustard in the Rectory with a candle holder.

… ooo..er.. missus???

I think I know why it won’t appear! I’ll soon find out

hi all first time blogger , i’m in Singapore and have my shiny new tickets for the game, will be my first ever liverpool game even though i have been a fan since 1974, next step come to the kop. YNWA

For everybody’s attention
How the money is distributed
The Premier League’s TV broadcasting deals brings in £2.7 billion over three years. Of this, £22.8 million is paid to every Premier League club as part of an equal share of revenue. On top of this, clubs are paid prize-money relative to their final position in the league (Manchester United got £14.4 million, Derby got £720,000) and then earnings from the live matches in which they are featured (Manchester United, with 25 matches, made £12.1 million, while Derby got the guaranteed minimum payment for clubs no-one watches of £5.6m).

Television revenue for 2007-08 season
(2006-07 in brackets)
Manchester United £49.3m (£32m)
Chelsea £45.6m (£30.9m)
Arsenal £47m (£29m)
Liverpool £45.4m (£28.4m)

As you can see we increased just in the Prem TV revenue by 16.9 mill, the TV revenue for 2008/2009 is over 3 billion, we, because we challenged this year, where on TV more than last so our share went up. This excludes the cash for where we finished it’s just TV revenue.
Lurgan those figures you posted are wrong the CL TV revenue is distributed by what T.V market brings in the most revenue and the UK is by far the biggest as posted by all financial listings on the net. Then the Prem split the revenue up according to where the teams finished in the league with Champions getting the most and the 4th placed team the least. Then it comes down to how far each team gets quarters, semi’s final, champions. Its very complicated and there is no set formula.
As we discussed.
Liverpools beleaguered co-owners, Tom Hicks and George Gillett, look set to ¬refinance their £350m loan with the Royal Bank of Scotland and Wachovia from next month’s deadline, the ¬Guardian has learned. The extension could cost up to £3.5m for the arrangement fee, with ¬interest payments – approximately 4% above the banking rate – similar to the terms on their current facility.
The two banks are willing to extend their loan, given rising income at a club who finished second in the Premier League last season, qualifying for the lucrative Champions League for a ¬seventh season in a row. “Banks won’t want to jeopardise growth through ¬taking control,” a source close to the situation said.
Facing multi-billion pound losses, banks are pushing unprofitable companies into insolvency or demanding ¬control through a debt-for-equity swap. In Spain the local savings bank Bancaja has ¬practically taken control of Valencia, who have about £500m of debt. However, the source added: “It doesn’t make sense to take control of a business that’s performing well; this approach could be applicable to Liverpool.”
The refinancing deal will buy Hicks and Gillett time as they attempt to avoid having to sell Liverpool, although their prospects of borrowing a further £400m to build a new stadium on Stanley Park have receded. Last week’s accounts included a warning from the accountants, KPMG, that there would be “significant doubt on the group’s and parent company’s ability to continue as a going concern” without an extension to the £350m loan. A source close to Hicks responded that the Texan was “very relaxed” and “confident”.

Kenny Lad, They operate a no porn policy and filter out all ladyboy nudie shots.

Keith, don’t you just love these “Sources.” As soon as I see “Source,” in any newspaper, I know it’s shite. But then I suppose this one is believeable, I’m sure Hicks is very relaxed and confident. He knows he’s sitting on a giant, and that, if he can ride this storm out, he’ll walk away with some huge bunce.

The question is, how much damage will it have done to the club by then?

But I’m not going to go on about it today. It just becomes depressing and self defeating, as there’s nothing to very little we can do about it.

It’s the same as when I blamed us fans for the take over in the first place. I wasn’t actually saying it was right down to us. Of course, there was very little we could have done about it, but lets face it… we done nothing but spread for them. It makes me feel ill whenever I see them old pictures of them bastards getting welcomed like the 2nd coming at Anfield.

Fact is, from Moores on down we all got conned and should be forced to walk around with KNOB stamped on our foreheads until they are gone.
We got warned by Texas Rangers fans. We got warned by Corinthian fans. We ignored it because we wanted to believe. So now, we have no choice but to get on with it.

It just maddens me whenever I see people saying things like… Well, we’re better since they came. They bought us Torres,” and things like that.

That attitude is what got us into this shit in the first place. We must remember that they have not invested one single penny into this club, they are only there to take not give, and the success we have had is despite of them, not because of them.

In fact, we haven’t won a thing since they took over. Don’t forget that lads.

But on a cheerier note, I think you are right about the long term outcome Keith. We will eventually rid ourselves of these parasites. We will eventually have a new stadium when they are gone. And, despite all their chicanery, we will also keep moving forward, even in the short term. I just thank fuck we have men, both on and off the pitch, that are determined to make this happen. And so, I suppose all we can hope for is the Loan Rangers take the money sooner than later and fuck off into the Texan sunset never to be heard of again.

PS…. It cut my avatar short. It says Old School underneath the badge. It’s me flag. Thought I’d put it up to see if any of you lads had seen it at the match. I know it was shown on telly at PSV and Madrid. Fucking 52 years of age, and carrying on like a big soft kid at the match as if I was still in the Boys Pen. I’m sure me missus must feel ashamed for me, cos I don’t give a fuck. I love it!

Bloody hell Keith, you should get a job as an Accountant (if your’e not one already)

Interesting reading though, your’e certainly keeping us up to date on the financial situ.

I don’t want to say who Rafa’s “one or two” signings will be. Two weeks ago it was going to be “two or three” signings. Shit happens, eh?

I just hope he gets more than the 2 million quid those pair of greedy bastards have just claimed in travel expenses!

That’s why wer’e all hooked on LFC FS.

It’s like a drug you don’t even want to get off.
I’m 46 but you’d never believe it when it comes to watching LFC. Fuck, I get so carried away, I’m sure I put most 12 year olds to shame. Iv’e always been like that and always will be. And you know what? I fucking love it! Would never want to change even if I could.

Are there limited tickets for the Ronnie Whelan gig timmy?

I had a look over the accounts last night. a few points.

£185m of the loan are secured with personal gurantees from the directors, the rest is secured against club assets.

On top of the bank loans, there is an inter-comany loan from caymen of £58m.

A major part of the company’s assets is Players registerations of £229m, over fixed assets only come to £78m (ground etc).

In effect the value of our players is secured against the bank loans.

Reading over the accounts I was trying to find positives, but they are in short supply, the only one being the personal gurantee of £185m.

With the banks, in Ireland at least over the last number of years, they have been reckless in their lending policies (some people were able to use a single property to get serveral mortages from several different banks). I am not sure how prudent the banks were when the two clowns did the deal to buy the club.

Steve I’m a complete knobhead when it comes to LFC. I remember when I got into me mid-thirties, I had some sort of brain fart and I started to get a bit ashamed about being so obsessed with such a trivial thing. I still loved playing. I played right up until I was 40 and fucked me knees right up, but I sort of turned me back on the professional game. I din’t copmpletely turn away, and it didn’t last very long. But for some mad reason, I thought there was much more important things. Well, there is, but you get my drift.

Now I’m like a kid again. I was on the phone with a few lads last night, making preperations for the coming pre-season tour in Europe. We aren’t even sure who we’re playing or when yet. But all of us were nearly pissing our knickers like school girls in excitment… I’m one of the youngest in the firm!

Anyway, came in here to post this. I’m sure a few of you lads will love it. It cheered me up…
ttp://www.liverpoolfc.tv/news/drilldown/N164691090610-0854.htm

I reckon that was the next big “Exclusive” we would have been getting battered with because Danny and Nando haven’t actually signed their new contracts yet.

I had a look at the accounts last night, a few points.

Bank loan 350m

185m is secured by personal gurantees by the directors, the balance against the clubs assets.

on the clubs assets, the players registerations make up a major part (229m) other fixed assets are valued at 78m.

In effect players values are a major source of security against the bank loans.

on top of the bank loan there is an inter-company loan of 58m from KHL (Caymen), which can not be repaid at the moment as it would make the company insolvent.

Well, I’m off out now, but another bit of good news….
ttp://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/liverpool-fc/liverpool-fc-news/2009/06/10/liverpool-fc-boss-rafa-benitez-warns-barcelona-50m-would-not-buy-javier-mascherano-100252-23834865/

Seems like Rafa, the club and the players are all determined to nip these rumours in the bud. Nice one.

How’s it coming along Kenny?

This could become the summer long avatar saga

War and Peace, Once Upon A Time In America, The Barry transfer Saga, Gobstoppers, Coronation Street, Degan’s Injury List, waiting for a few bob off H&G, Kenny’s Avatar

As far as I am aware FS because we are performing well as club, financially that is first profit in yonks, don’t forget we had debts of 80 mill under Moors as a club and business, know we are turning a profit, this has bought a 6 months extension for H&G to either find a buyer or investor or to come up with a permanent solution, refinancing deal that is sustainable in the long term. That could mean them selling other assets to bring the loan down or finding cheaper finance that would make their Kop Holdings viable as well. The odds are definitely on a investor or selling outright. However more importantly sooner rather than later, 6 months is not that long.

Looks like we`ll be rid of tweedle dum and tweedle dee by the time Kenny`s avatar appears!

Glad to see Rafa squash the Masch rumours.

Be ready for the Torres rumour “TORRES TO ACRINGTON STANLEY “exclusive” is coming up after the break” DA DA DA DA BOOM!

“Accrington stanley are to break the British transfer record to acquire the services of Liverpools Fernando Torres.Secret talks have apparently being held for months now and the deal is close to its conclusion.

A SOURCE close to Torres` agent has revealed:”It`s Fernando`s dream to play for accrington ever since he was a young boy.The fact that the club are in the merseyside area is a bonus for him as he dosen`t have to move house.He wants to thank all the LFC fans for the bounce song and asks if it can be passed on to the accrington faithful.”

The source close to Torres` agent Margarita Garay added:”Fernando has been drinking four pints of milk every day to seal his dream move”

Keith, are you sure that the CL TV revenues are split according premier league placings?

Do you have a link for reliable source on how this is broken down – I cannot find this info anywhere at the moment.

Other than this your figures are pretty much in-line with what I found.

BTW, do you know how much our contract with Shitanta was worth?

Lurgan, Setanta owe the Premiere League £30m that’s all I know. There are 6 package rights and they have 2 of them at the moment. From next season they only have one of the rights and Sky have the other 5. That’s 23 live matches. So the majority of the TV money come from Sky from next season onwards. The impact on PL clubs is not that great. The smaller SPL clubs are screwed because Setanta have most of the TV rights for that league.

If Setanta go under the PL will sell the rights to someone else. ESPN being favourites to buy them.

A point worth considering is LFC TV. It has 100 million viewers worldwide most of them viewing through Setanta. If Setanta go bust the channel is going to have to find another home and quickly.

It was written by someone on RAWK and I think it was Tomkins but I could be mistaken, all I know was I was surprised by the difference between 1st and 4th placed clubs I just figured they must know what they are talking about as somebody else had asked that same question. I also tried to get the info but could not find it except for the split between countries was based on how much TV revenue was brought in by each country and that the Prem was the largest market hence we received the most TV revenue. I also read that next year the club who won the CL could get as much as 65 mill pounds.

Why is it that people only calculate how much we will make next year… without including the increased costs that more or less offset it?

Torres wages went up 40k per week.
Aggers went up, as did Arby’s and Kuyts.
Severence packages for all the offloaded back-room lads and likely higher wages for the incoming bunch (can’t imagine KK will be on the same dosh as Ablett?)

We’re all clamoring for a big name striker/winger and right back. That’s gonna add to the wage bill.

…and steve & FS
if you can’t be in a teenage girl, you might as well act like one!
(was that wrong?)

How dare you FS – ladyboy nude photos? whatever next – alex fungus face in a thong?

still testing!

Teenage girls?

Teenage girl, well, I wouldn’t know how to catch one. I wouldn’t remember what to do, if I did and somehow I can’t see me 20 year old daughter calling one Mam. But Fergie Tramp in a thong… now there’s an idea.

hello

Hello Kenny, what’s up?

I must be thick. I can’t the gravatar working. I will not give up!! help

Kenny is your gravatar a snowman with a grey background ?

C`mon kenny the suspense is killing me..

It better be worth the wait amigo!

Stuck twenty on a 5/1 special today in ladbrokes.messi,kaka and apeboy all to score at any time.Well apeboy came up after 2 minutes so i`m waiting on messi now.Brazil are playing later on.

Guess what..the argies get a spotter you`d think with no regular penalty taker around just give it to messi yea?

Na not in Herman feckin munsters book.He takes the ball because he was fouled then he gets to take it.

What happens next?

He runs up to the ball as if he was at the feckin olympics doing the high jump in a semi circle motion and passes it into the keepers bloody hands.

It made berbatovs penalty in the FA cup semi-final look like a graham souness thunderbolt!

Jesus looking at the first half highlights there.

Messi missed a bloody open goal before i tuned in.

Ahhhhhh i might as well rip up me docket now!

Oh so it is working then rome – excellent.

It’s being reported that the Ladyboy has gone to Real Madrid for 80 million nicker.

80 Million! god damn, they could buy the toons with that type of money.

The last thing i wanted was ManU with 100 million of transfer kitty.

But then, now every player they would want to buy would cost twice the initial