Gerry,

It’s been such a disappointing season that we have to find solace in laughing at the Mancs.

Anyway, like you, I guess it’d be 3 centre backs this time, and am rooting for a bigger win, like 3-0, even though Benfica is strong.

HAHAHAHAHA!!! Joining in the schadenfreude as well. 3-0 up and the Scum-loving media was in full arse-licking mode, so sweet to see it all come crashing down when Robben scored the decisive 2nd goal.

I don’t think I’ve ever been this elated to see the Scum win a match before.

Great observation concerning the “controversial” Torres sub, Gerry. I too thought Torres was having a terrible game, he’s been missing horrendous sitters lately (that late one against the Scum and the 1-on-1 against Benfica), not to mentioned constantly being manhandled. I had to stay away from here for a while as I expected the over-reaction because of that sub.

It’s so much easier to blame the manager on one single decision for a bad game than blame the performance of the players, especially their over-reliance on Torres and Gerrard. Has anyone noticed that the team actually attacked better once Torres was taken off? Had Ngog held his nerve and converted either one of his chances, we would have been talking about what a brilliant tactical move Rafa has made. Of course, nothing ever works out 100%. Especially not in this “Beach Ball Season”.

The ref in the Benfica 1st leg was a disgrace, that’s all I have to say. So I hope Benfica get stuffed and receive the justice that they deserve in Anfield tonight.

BTW Gerry, have you seen Fatty lately? I haven’t seen him for ages. Just hope all these gloom and knee-jerkism hasn’t caused him to depart for good.

Yes Kinny, I really enjoyed that manc game. All of their supporters down in my local were giving it large when they were 3-0 up and throwing some abuse at the rest of us, but we most definitely had the last laugh and they didn’t like it one little bit.
One of them made the mistake of saying to me afterwards that had Rooney been fully fit they would have destroyed Bayern and I said to him, “Hang on a minute mate, I thought we were meant to be the one-man team!”
Anyway, as regards our old friend FS, other then the fact that he gets totally pissed off at times he also has periods when he is extremely busy. But I know he still pops in and reads the blogs and comments, and I’m sure he’ll be back when he gets a chance.

I’ll take a 1-0 win tonight with a 92nd min goal off the referee’s heel from a throw-in.

I’d take an injury time Luisao foul on Torres, resulting in a red card for him and Steve G converting the resulting penalty

Great blog Gerry,
AxC, i’d take solace in the mancs geting beat even if we won everything in sight,
as Kinny has pointed out about the media and the mancs (sounds like something from The Chronicles of Narnia) it was sickening, as he was getting interviewed they where pointing out the possible excuses, rafael sent off, homing in on rooney’s injury amongst others instead of saying “you were 3-0 up and you blew it”, to me it makes Istanbul even the more sweeter, as i said in the last blog 3 is never enough in the C/L.
Did anyone see the banner “rooney the white Pele”
i wonder what Messi is then.

good stuff ger. to tough to call as you say its all about which side shows up tonight but given our home form and the big boost seeing the mancs go out will have on the crowd i think we’ll just have too much for them. lets hope so. stevando 2-0.

on the mancs im delighted but im keeping my trap shut i can just smell us v chelsea turning out to be that big dilemma where we’ll beat them and hand the mancs the title so even though id take that if it gives us forth it’ll still be a bitter pill to swallow even more so if i’ve been mouthing off for weeks!

theredman,

may i add the following:
(1) What happened to the MAN MARKING from Man U when Robben scored?
(2) Why is the 30m pound striker on the bench for 80 minutes? Surely you don’t put 30m on the bench? What would happen to his confidence? Would that make him a lousy player later? Surely it’s Fergie’s fault!!!
(3) Why does the manager risk his star striker’s injuries? Does he know the consequences of disrupting the league campaign, and more importantly, England’s World Cup hopes?

Hahahahahahahaha

Anyway, this week has effectively put to rest the “Rooney best player in the world hype” that the English press has been championing all season.

Hahahahahahahahaha

Oh how sweet it will be to see Fergie’s house of cards crashing down on his head. Does anyone know whether they’ll be forced to sell some more players in the summer because of their very own financial predicament? I’ve heard some manc supporters talking about signing a bunch of quality players, but I can’t see it happen.

Anyway, just to see them lose out on the big titles is enough joy for me after the season of dread we’ve been through ourselves. Still hoping for Arsenal in the league (though Chelsea seem the more likely champions at the moment) while the outcome of the FA cup is completely indifferent to me.

To be honest I think it’s time to prepare for the worst as regards to the league finish. As I see it, we have less chance of finishing 4th right now, than we had of winning the title exactly one year ago. But on the other hand, the odds are still better that we’ll make it than it was half time in Istanbul, so let’s keep the fingers crossed. We still have a very good chance of winning the Europa League and that would certainly be worth something, not least of all having a more successful season than the mancs.

Last night I was watching Season 2 of The Sopranos. After a particular episode I turned it to the manc match and saw Olic celebrating his goal. 3-1. 4-3 on aggregate. I thought the mancs will probably still win it so I put on another episode of Sopranos. When that was finished I turned it back to the match and saw 3-2. 4-4 on aggregate. 87 mins gone. A broad grin appeared on my face and then at the final whistle I had to laugh. I remember when the draw was made every pundit had United in the final. Taggart’s interview was class. “They got the lad sent off, typical Germans, that’s what their all like!” Hahahaha! Cunt.

I am actually hoping Rooney isn’t too badly injured because they have to play City and Spurs in the next couple of weeks and I’d like them to win both matches. (I’ll go wash my mouth out with original Listerine now).

Gerry, great blog by the way and I feel the same. I have been enjoying football recently, except for ours. Sunderland game aside. If we can play like we did against Sunderland then I think we’ll blow Benfica away. That’s a big ‘IF’ though. You just never know what we’ll get. We have 3 home games in a row including tonight. 3 good wins could set us up nicely for the rest of the season.

I fancy a 3-1 as well.

How about Taggart’s man management with the likes of Berbatov eh? 29 year old world class centre forward. Costing over £30m. Scored 173 goals in 367 games in club football before joining the mancs. That’s 1 every 2 games. Has 48 goals in 77 games for Bulgaria. Despite this he can’t get in the side when the mancs have a big game and has a record of 26 goals in 81 games – the poorest return in his career. Looks like he’s in the Veron category.

So much for the Prem being the best league.Can’t afford to give free kicks around the box, one strike and it could be curtains.Time for Kuyt and Benny to score.

Hi gang, just finished drying my tears over the latest Manure injustice. The best team won eh Fergie, eh …then lost, well what can you do when it’s foreigners you’re paying sorry playing in Europe. And foreign referees too. Not good enough really.

Gerry, spot on analysis vis a viz ‘Nando last 30 mins.

As for tonight we are gonna have to be at our best. They are good, fast and i reckon will be happy to play it either on the break or take it to us if needs be. They beat us last time in Anfield, 3 wins in a row now for Benfica. Add to that we can’t seem to defend a lead for life nor money. This is not gonna be easy.

Babel & Insua out, no left fullback. Special K is a starter for me. They murdered us in the air last week. Also the right side, Glenda i assume, will have to be totally focused as Di Maria looks a player and a superb passer for them. Kuyt will start on the right i think to support Glenda.

Reina

Glenda, Special K, JC, Agger

Mascher and Aquilani (if fit)

Kuyt, Stevie, Benny / Pachego

Torres

Gerry and lads: Can’t believe you think going with a 3-5-2 formation is the way to go!!

Benfica will come to Anfield playing one up top no doubt and will want to keep it tight and hit us on the break. Why then will we need 3 centre backs??? Secondly, we’ve not used this formation at any stage during this miserable shitty season and to switch now in this huge game is folly of the highest order.

Play Agger at left, and Carragher and The Greek in the middle – we need to keep it tight ourselves. If we play our usual formation I can see us win 3-1

RAFAEL BENITEZ has expressed his ongoing frustration at Liverpool’s stifling financial position by warning the club will stagnate further without fresh investment this summer.
And the unhappy Spaniard believes the situation must change in the near future after declaring he has taken the current squad of players as far as possible – and that the Anfield outfit cannot expect to win the Premier League title if they are restricted to wheeling and dealing in the transfer market.
A weary Benitez is seething at the continued failure of Liverpool to attract new investment, the latest setback coming when the deadline passed on Monday over a proposed £110million cash injection from the Rhone Group.
While the Anfield board have not given up hope an agreement can be reached with the New York-based fund management firm, Benitez – who had met with representatives of the group to discuss their plans – is convinced their interest is now over.
Earlier this week, Fernando Torres sounded his fear that Liverpool would be unable to challenge realistically for honours without a clutch of new players in the summer.
And as he prepared for tonight’s Europa League quarter-final second leg against Benfica, Benitez underlined the stark reality of the club’s predicament.
“Some players have been talking of what we need for the future and I agree,” said the Liverpool manager. “You can’t expect any more from the players we have here now but if we want to take one step forward we need some money to compete with the top four.
“For six months I was really optimistic, especially with this group (Rhone) but they’re not there now. For six months I have been waiting for investment and trying to focus in football, and I will do the same again now because it’s best for the club.
“For six years I have been wheeling and dealing to keep this club at a very good level. When I signed for five more years I knew it could be difficult, but we were waiting for the investment and the players had the same opinion.
“Hopefully it will change for the better in the summer. I agree with the players that we need some new players and need to improve. The cost of those players is very clear – if we need three or four, like some people are saying, we will need some money.
“Something has to change, and I have my ideas – hopefully new investors will come and we can talk about those things.”
Liverpool’s co-owners Tom Hicks and George Gillett have until July to reduced their £237m debt burden by £100m by July if they are to be granted a deal to refinance their loans and begin work on the planned new stadium on Stanley Park.
Managing director Christian Purslow had identified Easter as the time by which he “hoped” to have a deal agreed with an outside investor, one of many deadlines during the past six months that has expired without any agreement being reached.
And Benitez added: “For six years in a row we were in the Champions League, which was unexpected. I have tried to do my best since the beginning here and you look at the value of the club and the squad now. We have spent a lot but also brought in a lot too. Just look at the net spending of some other clubs.
“You saw the club last year and if we want to go one step forward now we need to do some things differently, and not just on the pitch, but I have money to spend in the summer – I think.
“Every manager can make mistakes, they are different in each club. Others can make two or three £20-30m mistakes, but not here. Here I can make a substitution and people will be talking about it for a week like it’s the end of the world.
“We try to do our best every year in the market. Of course managers make mistakes, but expectations are too high and it has been really difficult. I have been listening to rumours for six months. We have had some talks with investors and we are still here without confirmation.”
Liverpool have endured a miserable season, crashing out at the first hurdle in the Champions League, FA Cup and League Cup and seemingly on course to miss out on a top-four Premier League finish.
The Europa League is their only remaining hope of silverware, with Benitez’s side looking to overturn a 2-1 deficit at Anfield this evening following last week’s controversial first leg in Lisbon.
And when put to him that teams who wheel and deal don’t win championships, the Spaniard said yesterday: “I know. It’s a complicated season because from the beginning we had some situations we knew about. We were waiting for investors and carried on.
“People are still talking but don’t see the big picture, and that’s the future of the club. But wheeling and dealing makes it very difficult to stay at the level everyone’s expecting.
“I have to be positive and think the investor will come. Yesterday I watched Barcelona against Arsenal, in a massive stadium, big money and lots coming through the system. That’s the way to do things if you want to compete at the maximum level.
“A lot of people know the situation and the best way to deal with it now is simply to focus on this game. But I am not happy with the situation.”

RAFA BENITEZ today admitted he has made mistakes this season – but has promised to atone by leading Liverpool into the Europa League semi-finals.

The Reds’ boss has been under scrutiny prior to tonight’s clash with Benfica, mainly due to his decision to substitute Fernando Torres at Birmingham City on Sunday.

Benitez maintains that was still the right decision – Torres was struggling with exhaustion and a knee problem – but has accepted he has erred in other areas, such as tactics and squad investment.

However, he is anxious not to dwell on the negatives and is determined to concoct a winning formula tonight, as the Reds aim to overhaul a first leg 2-1 deficit and blow Benfica away at Anfield.

“If a big club like Liverpool depends on one substitution, then I think something is wrong – we have to concentrate on the game,” said Benitez.

“Everybody can mistakes but the big picture remains the same. The future of the club is more than just one substitution.

“I have made mistakes, like everyone. Big mistakes? Sometimes. I think every manager is always making mistakes. The difference is being able to manage as a club.

“I will not say which team but they signed four wingers for £10m, £15m, £20m and they have had a player who has not played for them all season.

“We signed one player, for example, that has had problems during the season and we cannot manage, so it seems we are short. That means we have to do something.”

The key, however, to ‘doing something’ lies in investment; Torres said in an interview yesterday that Liverpool paid the price for failing to make key signings last summer and Benitez agrees.

But how the financial deadlock will be broken remains to be seen; the Rhone Group are still waiting to discover whether their £113m bid for a 40 per cent stake in the club will be accepted and another unnamed group are also looking.

“I don’t want to say too much because we have to concentrate on the game but I totally agree with Fernando – we have to invest if we want to move forward,” said Benitez.

“We need investors, we need money because the market is very expensive. We want to go one step forward and that is the most difficult step.

“We have to invest because we cannot make any mistakes. For us, it is not easy. But the players are working very hard and we have to stick together to try and progress.

“We have been in the Champions League for the past six years and, thanks to this, the club still has the big name that it has in the past.

“We have brought in a lot of money playing in Europe and we want to be there; if we are there again, it will be easier for an investor to see the club as an opportunity.”

Benitez is toying with the idea of playing three central defenders tonight.

New Liverpool away kit http://www.anfield-online.co.uk/lfc-news/2010/new-liverpool-away-kit-2010-11/

Home kit
http://footballfashion.wordpress.com/2010/04/07/liverpool-fc-adidas-201012-home-kit-jersey/

LB: where did that come from???

VERY VERY interesting stuff from Rafa – essentially saying what many in here have been saying for many many months

Pressure has just be ranked up a notch on our Inept Yank owners

Goo one LB #11. And to think people are slating Rafa’s treatment on Keane, and no one’s slating Redknapp as well.

Digger,
If this is not press prejudice, then prove me otherwise.

If the Mancs fail to win at Blackburn on Sunday (and I think it will be a draw) and Chelsea then beat Bolton at Stamford Bridge next Tuesday, then I think we can beat Chelsea at Anfield in May and still watch them clinch the title at SB on the final day. That’s the way I see it panning out.

Tonight? 2-0 to the Reds!

Bang on LB,
i like the line that say’s “he makes one substitution and people talk about it for a week”, the tramp played rooney knowing he was crocked and it did’nt pay off, berbatov must be feeling on top of the world, remember his little dummy and dribble on the by-line last season according to sky he was a “genius thats why the tramp bought him”, i bet now he is thinking oh how i wish we had Tevez back.

Super stuff Gerry,

Whats done is done with the substitution.I`ve already given my two cents on that in the last blog so i`ll leave it at that.I just hope some positive can come of it if Nando looks fresh and up for it tonight.

I expect there`ll be a highly charged atmosphere at Anfield tonight.Do the business and we can take it on to Fulham on sunday.I`ll be going to the fulham game sunday with my lad it will be hisfirst time at Anfield.

I too had a good laugh off the mancs last night in the local.As the game wore on a couple of non scum fans were there questioning every decision the mancs got and agreeing wholeheartedly with every decision munich got.

One mancs who drinks there,a fat fucker who despises our club kept saying “why are the scousers here,fuck off boys thursday night is your night”.Obviously we were gettting to him and when Robben scored and when the final whistle blew,the barman,who was the most vocal of us all right on que said “thats it,off to the history channel for you lot,will i turn it on since its YOUR night?”

Fat manc nearly blew his top off,the whole bar was in stitches even some manc supporters.

Guess you had to be there but it was a funny moment.

What about the bitter tramp again.Always blaming everyone but himself when they lose.

Prick.

http://i291.photobucket.com/albums/ll294/citytaxis091525252/Rafafingerjpg.jpg

Another…

http://img22.imageshack.us/img22/8861/11665140.jpg

A sher one for the road

http://img199.imageshack.us/img199/967/ferguson.jpg

Great Blog , Gerry. It truly has been hard to watch the Team this season.I used to go into games confident of us winning, now I wonder if we can even get a point out of games we should be winning comfortably.
We really do need a cash infusion, but where that will come is the big question.
Sounds like the Rhone Group have bailed on us.

Enough said about the Torres sub..we now need to go for it tonight.

I think Rafa goes with three at the back .
Masher to have a big game in midfield.
Torres and Kuyt to get the goals, with possibly a third form Stevie G.

Come on you Reds……

As always, great timing for this blog Gerry. I’d missed your quips.

It’s impossible to express the joy I felt on seeing OT silenced by a goal that WAS coming! And Liverpool is a two-man team! It’s still much better than a one-man team!

The Benfica game was a sham, with their fans DISGRACEFUL! Their team tactics aren’t far from their fan behavior. I remain positive our Scouse Warriors will prove all of us wrong.

I am happy too the monotony of English clubs dominating the CL took a hiatus. A change is as good as a rest. Of course, Chelsea and Arsenal are still two behind Nottingham Forest! What was that SAF about knocking LFC off their f____ perch? We still have the two you’d give anything for! Muhahahahahahahaha!

This season notwithstanding, I still believe. Siempre es posible. YN(Ever)WA(Ever)!

Liverpool Football Cub we love you. Make us proud tonight. Put those dirty cheating Benfica scumbags in their place.

Reds 2 Scum 0

Im gonna go with this formation tonight and im saying 4-1
Reina
Carragher-Kyrgiacos-Agger
Mascherano
Johnson-Gerrard-Lucas-Babel
Kuyt
Torres

Last 2 paragraphs of LB 15. You may be getting your wish Digger et al.

I am nervous about tonight as per my post above. I hope to The Great FOoTBALLING Gods that our well earned gloat over the manure going down the toilet last night doesn’t come back and bite us on the bollix.

I go for a very nervy 2-0 (my heart).

Lucas with a header to seal it !!!

Red4life,

I`d go with that team IF rafa were going with 3 at the back.Only i`d have Aquallini instead of lucas.

If he was going 4 at back i think johnson could play left full as he played him there at the start of the season.

So it could look like this..

Reina
Carra,Kerry Argos,Agger,johnson
Masch
Kuyt,Gerrard,benny
Aquallini
TorrES.

Team sheet up yet?

Don’t know – waiting for it myself.

supposedly aqua’s on the bench.

Redscouse here you go..

http://www.uefa.com/uefaeuropaleague/matches/season=2010/live/index.html?matchday=12&day=1&match=2000962

here’s a link

http://www.uefa.com/uefaeuropaleague/matches/season=2010/live/index.html?matchday=12&day=1&match=2000962

Thanks guys.

Too slow Lurg!

story of my life TT

Don`t be putting yourself down pal you`ve the CBC to do that for you

I think kuyt is losing the ball too much.Every time we pass to him play seems to break down

Also gerrard should tuck into a 3 man midfield and we could push the wide men up and try and control the game we keep losing the ball as soon as we get it

Kuyt has responded perfectly by giving us the lead. The linesman who raised his flag when Kuyt scored is a big time clown. Fair play to the referee for overruling his assistant.

Nice goal by Lucas. Benfica, however, remain dangerous, so our defenders need to remain focused.

Haven’t read the blog or the comments yet… but “I feel it is my duty as a fully paid up member of the sad, pathetic little man society to open up” … my comments by saying…

…to all the Lucas-Bashers out there…
…Who repeatedly insist, with total and complete certainty in their opinion, that “He doesn’t get forward enough” …and… “he can’t finish”…
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
Don’t you look the arse now?

Why are we still playing 442 ???????????

Go on dirk don’t listen to those knee jerkers

That torres finish reminded me of king kenny in his pomp

red4life #30,

Wow! Except that you forgot Babel was suspended for this tie, you’ve got everything spot on, even the final score!

A well deserved victory!!!

Dare I say we have found ourselves a new left back.

Good performance by all.I would say the advantage other big teams have over us when they play these sort of teams is these teams think if they go after us they will get a win.With the other teams they go in scared and play within themselves and get beaten easier

Cheers Timmy..
Great Victory …Well done the ” Lads”
I was on pins and needles as usual..

Rafa for prime minister anyone…….

Maybe i’m getting carried away

YNWA

Aitch on #45,

I join you in laughing at the Lucas Bashers. If he and Masch together are defensive, please explain both 4-1 results today and at Old Toilet!

People just refuse to believe the effects of injuries and disruptions on the team. Now that most of the team is fit and ready, we do see that Lucas can attack, and yes, score

I know you boy’s will agree LFC beat a fuckin good team tonight,
how the fuck the scum beat us and Birmingham got a draw is bewildering seeing the way we played tonight, under the cosh for the first 15 to 20 mins and then we start passing them to fuck and bang 2-0 like the old old Liverpool in Europe.
And i know i said i will not have channel 5 on again so i did’nt, i went round to the local club and watched it there fuckin marvelous atmosphere.

First of all, well done to Red4life for predicting the correct scoreline tonight, and to Dougle for predicting that Lucas would score, (even if it wasn’t a header) what a fine goal he got!

Torres made up for his glaring miss in Lisbon with two very different and very fine goals.

I thought Mascherano was awesome tonight, both with his usual tenacity and the excellent and accurate range of passing he displayed tonight. A top performance.

So an all English final is still on the cards and we must congratulate Fulham on reaching their first ever European Semi-final. It’s ironic that we are playing them at Anfield on Sunday, in what will now be billed as a possible dress rehersal for the Hamburg Final, and with both English clubs playing the 2nd leg of their Semi-Final at home, I certainly wouldn’t bet against it.

Obviously I hope we thrash them on both occasions and we owe them after they gave us a 3-1 beating at Craven Cottage last October!

Torres missed out through injury on a return to Atletico Madrid in the CL last season, but he should now get the chance to remind them what they are missing. I wanted LFC to make us feel proud tonight and they certainly did that.

Onwards and upwards!

A good commentary here:
http://www.goal.com/en-gb/news/2865/comment/2010/04/08/1869336/liverpool-comment-dirk-kuyt-and-lucas-leiva-step-out-of-the

Kyrgiakos for my MOM today. Terrific display from him… and perhaps more importantly… kept his head on a number of occasions when those around him seemed to be lose theirs.
Well done Zeus.

Well done the Reds (even if we did give the ball away incessantly… as though we wanted to piss it away ???)

Kudos to Lucas and Kuyt.
A nod to SG… (since I’ve regularly criticised this season, I’ll give credit where its due.)

And WELL DONE RAFA!
Got his team right!
Got his tactics right!
Did his subs right!

Lovely jubbley ! Gotta say I got a bit worried after we gifted them the goal but that’s the way I am. An outstanding Rafa-ish performance tonight.
From 30 mins on (first goal as I arrived in bar) we controlled the game. We looked really solid at the back, great to see Agger and Special k doing the business.
Mascher actually passed very well and Lucas did a power of hard work and won countless tackles as well as doing my prediction proud. Delighted for the man (a future Captain I reckon … you read it here boys).
Nando slightly misfired at times so a 2 goal haul was all we got from him tonight !!!!!!! GLEEEEEEE (…. and to think Mr Ferguson thought he wasn’t worth it … Berbatov 30Ml, pair of Tossers).
And lo and behold Stevie is starting to wake up, beginning to look interested is our captain. Actually gave Lucas a big hug after his goal.
More of this please NOW.
Kuyt saved it for europe and the nut-meg, goal, assist and general all round guts, smarts and drive more than made up for his occassional blooper.
Feck it they were all great!
Going to bed happy. A great week so far. Nice to be meeting the only other EPL team in Europe this weekend, fans should have a few good chants together.
We may be a tottering, fading giant on financial life-support being bled dry by asset stripping lying 2-faced scum but it’s good to be us tonight.

Aitch,

It’s good to see you trying to tilt the balance against the Rafa bashers who are supposed Liverpool fans. Anyone notice not one of them comes in to congratulate the team?

Well done Rafa! Please continue to shut the mouths of those fellows!

Very good win and a decent enough performance against a handy enough team. Have to say they (Benfica) really got on my nerves – cynical dirty fuckers the lot of them

But lads (i.e Aitch #45 and Axe # 54) one swallow does not make a summer. Lucas had a typical “Lucas type” game – industrious, totally committed. The only difference was that he scored…HIS FIRST GOAL OF THE SEASON. So I’d get off the high horses – we still shouldn’t be playing both Masch and Lucas at the same time – certainly not at home (and when we have a £20 million player sitting on the bench)

Good win – wouldn’t get carried away – we never controlled the game but was very happy with the attitude of the lads. As Bulgar #50 mentioned, have we found our new left back? – I thought Agger didn’t do a single thing wrong. Paddy the Greek was very good, as well as Benayoun, Kuyt and Torres.

Glad to see Rafa didn’t go totally insane and play 3 centre backs!

Can`t wait for sunday.Fulham had a great result tonight.I think all their eggs are in one basket so we should take advantage of that on sunday.

Superb night for the lads.Benfica are a damn good side.Make no bones about it they were in the game before we got the fourth.I`d Dej va vou from the manc game at 3-1.

Anyway i`m delighted for lucas.Kinda takes a monkey off the lads back.The treatment of a player that gives his heart and soul for the red jersey is downright disgraceful.

Torres with another brace is good news.To be honest Nando didn`t look himself again but a fine finish to the great move for the second and a sublime finish for the fourth did the business for us.Well in Nando KID!!

Arthur, please.
Lucas has been making those forward runs, and getting forward into those types of positions all season.
Frequently, a poor pass has never made it to him, or was over hit (quite often by SG). Today it was perfectly weighted and he rounded the keeper and finished well.

Yes it was his first goal… but people bang on about him as though he only ever sits 2 yards in front of Carragher for 90 minutes.

Just because both Lucas and Mascherano are on the team sheet, does not automatically mean the team just sits back, defensively.
Yes we often have… even in past seasons… but this is just one of those myths that has become accepted… when very often the truth is that Lucas has often gotten forward, into some very promising positions only for it theplay to breakdown.

This season, despite the team playing poorly as a whole, he has been one of our most consitent performers…
…and yes… this has often meant him sitting deep…
…but this has usually been in games where our established players were losing the ball, our defenders were bypassing midfield and just hoofing it straight back to the opposition (as happened quite a lot today) and he was actually REQUIRED to sit deep, as we were often under threat.

Should we play Masch & Lucas every week?
Probably not.
But it certainly isn’t a celar cut no-no, as some would suggest.

As for a 20 million player sitting on the bench… we’ll likely see loads of him next season… but his appearances while showing massive potential, have been patchy at best.

Anyone who’s ever coached successfully can tell you… Your “best 11″ is NOT always the top names… its the 11 best form/fit players. Period.

As for today’s game.
I agree, we shouldn’t get carried away… (aw, fuckit, why not…let’s…)
… we did give the ball away an aweful lot. Seemed like we were conspirring to lose the game at times.

And as cynical as Benfica’s approach to the game was… they are a very good footballing side. Some of their footy was as good as the stuff people are salivating over Barca for…
… but for some reason, they seamed to think they had to get overly physical with us.
I think if they’d just played footy, we’d have been in trouble… (in both legs)
… but fortunately, they got all wrapped up in gamesmanship and trying a bit of the cheat… and a better ref didn’t buy it… and that allowed us the foothold we needed to take the game to them.

3 center-backs isn’t necessarily a bad idea… but you have to have the right personnel to effect it… and we don’t… or at least didn’t have them available tonight… so yeah, in this instance, a back 3 would have played into their hands.

I was actually a bit surpried that Johnson didn’t push forward more (effecting a sort of occasional-temp-back-3) but then again… they seemed to identify that side as our week link (which made no sense, given that our left was the makeshift)
But I thought Johnson was the poorest of the lot tonight…
…I don’t know if he was just not having a good game… or the fact that they were pressuring down his side and he was busier and therefore prone to more mistakes…
… but I’ll give him the benefit of the doubt and say the latter.

superb performance and result well done reds,rafa and fans our home form has been great fully expect it to continue on sunday. can we somehow take it on the road? we shall see, a good few days to be a red. but lets not start shouting from the rooftops just yet a very though semi ahead and hopefully a nerve jangling last couple of weeks.

oh… and since I menttioned it.
Kudos to the ref. He had a very good game tonight.

He was a tad on the lenient side in terms of handing out cards… but he let the game flow when it made sense, and while he didn’t show cards much, he did give a “stern word” on a number of occasions, to try to cool things down.

I’d say he got most of the big decisions right too… And there were a few of them to make given some of their theatrics.

Lucas MOM for me when he broke through on goal i actually thought it was Torres and i was certain he’d score.His crunching tackle basically set up another and i think he stopped one on the line basically he had a Gerrard-like performance.
When Kuyt scored and they tried to disallow it i was sure if it was at Benfica it wouldnt of stood Torres should of had a Pen only for them to get a free kick for a similar challenge resulting in their goal. Quite a few of their tackles should of been Yellow carded in the first 30 mins especially as they got away with so much last week.
Any way i felt a 4-1 coming at HT as a punishment a bit like Real last year.

I see the Ref who f*cked up at the Toilet when he allowed Chelsea to beat the Mancs as been duly punished and demoted. ( I mean how f*cking dare he disobey his lord and master, doesn’t he know who he’s f*cking with )

@60 Axchoice bit harsh i think the amount of alcohol drunk during the game might delay some people’s comments i’ve only just sobered up :-]
YNWA

Rome77,

I know I’m a bit harsh. But don’t you think those guys who come in every time when there’s a bad result aren’t harsh as well?

I’m just trying to show them some knee jerk reactions that Arthur has rightly pointed out of me

Lucas’s goal was a big FUCK YOU to all those bashers out there who can’t appreciate his skills and unsung heroics all this time.

To those who still think he’s rubbish, please tell that to Dunga, who’s planning on taking him to South Africa for the World Cup.

Today’s ref, and most of the refs in European games says one thing:

Of 10 European refs, you may get 1 as disgraceful as the one at the Benfica first leg.

But of 10 Premier League refs, you’ll encounter 9. Especially if your name is Liverpool.

To the Scum cocksucking media cunts: THIS is how you defend a lead. May their pathetic circus come crashing down swiftly and epically.

And congratulations to Fulham. Hodgson is one of those managers I don’t particularly dislike, as he isn’t a disciple of the Dark Side of the M62. I think he’s said he’ll be prioritizing now that they’re in the semis. So this Sunday’s potential “Europa Final Dress Rehearsal” we’ll be seeing a different Fulham team (and hopefully 3 points in the bag, being at Anfield helps as well).

That 3rd goal was like an operatic song.

“Torres’s eventual contribution more than justified Rafael Benitez’s decision to replace him during Sunday’s 1-1 draw with Birmingham to rest a knee injury, but initially he appeared to be struggling against the Portuguese champions and was in some discomfort.” – BBC (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/europe/8606943.stm)

Nice blog gerry, must admit looking at the torres sub and your comment plus some of the lads i can see it might have been the right thing, having said that i;d have liked ngog and nando together for at least ten mins.

Fucken great win this morning[ my time]….and credit where credits due, a great goal by lucas…4 everyone having an orgasm about it its his first all season…if he was scoring a few more like this people would ease up on the lad, i just hope this gives him a bit more confidence to push on from this, it takes more than 1 goal a season to become a great central midfielder…also lets not forget benfica were all over us in midfield for the most part and i am still pissed thar we dont pass to lucas or masch more from the back..theres loads of opportunities to pass the short ball thru the mid instead we are hoofin the ball to noone carra is the wost, aggar had a great game benfica had nothin down our left.

Rafa got it spot on tonight and i really enjoyed readin his comments and his views on where he made mistakes ect..this is the man id trust to take us forward and credit to him i am extremly fucken happy for rafa and the boys.

Aitch @ 63: You beat me to replying to Arthur’s comment @ 61 & couldn’t have said it better! Also Arthur: ‘beat a handy enough team’? If I remember correctly, these cocksuckers beat our small blue neighbours 2-0 at Goodison, and should have scored more by all accounts. With regards to Lucas, he makes these runs every game he plays but the final ball and/or his finishing has let him down. It was just great to see him finish like a world-class striker even though he is a ‘defensive’ midfielder? Can’t wait to start trawling the internet (LFC & Times, SS etc) & see what the press and some of our ‘fans’ have to say about his performance last night.
Not having a pop at you Arthur, but it does seem that you are very reluctant to praise Lucas & Rafa for his tactics last evening
Also noticed that the 1st player to celebrate Lucas’s goal with him was Nando, then Benny & Stevie also looked delighted.
Fucking great win, but not trying to get too carried away. Also loved all the jokes at the Mancs expense being aired over the radio here in S.Africa. Love it!

Another good read, guys

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/liverpool-fc/liverpool-fc-news/2010/04/09/make-no-mistake-liverpool-fc-manager-rafael-benitez-got-it-right-against-benfica-100252-26206125/?

Rafa, I did praise the manager and the team’s attitude but I didn’t think it was a vintage performance. As Aitch rightly said, had Benfica cut out all the niggly fouls and cynicism, we might have been in trouble. They completely owned the ball last night for the first 15 mins before we eventually got into the match.

But basically as I said, it’s been a poor season and to be honest the 5 remaining league games are more important than either the semis or the potential final, so I won’t be getting too carried away

On the Lucas issue – we’ll just have to have agree to disagree. Never doubt the lads heart just his technical ability when we already play Mascherano alongside him. Can there be any coincidence that we played our best football of the year against Sunderland when we played Gerrard and Mascherano alongside each other? Methinks not

Arthur,

Whether the team plays well depends a lot on the players’ form and that of the opposition.

You took the game against Sunderland as proof of that Gerrard-Masch partnership. I can also take last season’s 4-1 winner at Old Toilet as proof that Lucas-Masch combination is even more effective.

Read what Aitch said in #63. He also agrees that Lucas-Masch is probably not the first choice (i.e. week-in-week-out) partnership in central midfield.

What we’ve been trying to tell you is that Lucas has his qualities, and isn’t that bad a player for you to tag him as not good enough for the team. If he’s good enough for Dunga to include in his Brazil team and also for Rafa to include in his Liverpool team, he must have some capabilities.

Arthur, whilst I am a Lucas supporter – my support of him is strengthened by the fact that a lot of fans & especially media continually ridicule him despite the fact that he is a Brazilian international, and he constantly gives 110% for the team unlike more ‘noted’ players this season – I would agree with you that I don’t really like to see him & Masch player together in the midfield. But maybe Rafa has had little option this season? Saying that, we did beat the Mancs 2-1 and 1-4 with the 2 of them together. Hell, it looks like I’m contradicting myself here. Imagine the poor manager & the decisions he has to face. But he seems to get it right more often than not. Oh, and you also need to take into consideration that Stevie does not like to play as a holding midfielder, or a left or right-sided midfielder. He only really wants to play behind the striker, and I suppose Rafa has to take his skipper’s wishes into consideration?
My only worry right now is that we seem to have a great game, and then a mediocre/crap performance the next. Just happy that we are at Anfield on the weekend. And great to hear the Kop singing Rafa’s name.

Great blog Gerry.

Could not post immediately after we won. Really wanted to have a go at all those who kept talking about Rafa’s removal after Sunday’s game.

It was a great victory. Benfica were better when it came to holding the ball and passing it around but we did the job where it mattered. We were lethal in our finishing.

Kudos to Lucas,Krygiakos,Agger,Kuyt who by the way are all Rafa Benitez’s signing.

Rafalution,

Some corrections, here on #75. Last season’s 2-1 win at Anfield had Alonso-Masch in central midfield (just checked the official website), but this season’s 2-0 against Mancs at Anfield featured Lucas-Masch.

But Ax – the Lucas/Masch partnership HAS BEEN the partnership week in, week out! Anyway here’s hoping that next season we won’t see as often. I do agree Lucas does have his qualities – not doubting that. Just not enough offensive qualities (assits, goals) that we need when we’re also playing Mascherano

think its gas talk about knee-jerkers next of all it will be lucas player of the year.. he had a great game lads fair play too him i hope he can continue in this vain of form right til the end. but we still have the more important little matter of finishing in the top four ahead something thats essential to the clubs long term future not being able to say i told you so after every solid performance no :-0

I see that the Lucas Masch thing has reared its ugly head again.

So, question. Should we keep Agger at LB for the remainder of the season and use Insua as back-up?

Agger was immense last night and didn’t put a foot wrong. Also, brings some much needed height as well.

Answers on a postcard, or alternatively here in kopblog.

Arthur,

Agree with you on #78 regarding not seeing their partnership as frequent as this season.

The reasons for their partnership week in week out this season are (1) injury crisis & (2) Gerrard’s loss of form until the last month or so.

In fact, Lucas has not started every game with Masch since the improvement of both Gerrard’s form and the team’s injury problems, which is around end of February.

I hope that next season we won’t have such a bad injury crisis so that Rafa has many choices to fit his tactics against different teams.

Lurgan – I think he made a very good claim for that role. Could save us some money in the summer. Maybe have a Carragher/Greek & Skrtel centre back partnership and keep Agger out there? I dunno – it’s a possibiliy – maybe use Insua a bit less next season?

I was thinking that too last night Lurgan.

Agger did a sound job there.I wouldn`t move him.Rafa may do.We don`t know.

Fulham hopefully will have one eye on their semi so hodgson might make a few changes.I`d say it was hard work holding onto a 1-0 lead for 90 minutes last night.

I`m off ov

I was thinking that too last night Lurgan.

Agger did a sound job there.I wouldn`t move him.Rafa may do.We don`t know.

Fulham hopefully will have one eye on their semi so hodgson might make a few changes.I`d say it was hard work holding onto a 1-0 lead for 90 minutes last night.

Bit of a fook up there.Was gong to say i`m off over on saturday for the game on sunday and i`ve to then bring the lad to the echo arena for the WWE event so it will be a busy day.

Anyone see the Tramp at Aintree yesterday.His horse won and they interviewed him and his co-owner.

Tramp;”We`re going for the Gold Cup next year ain`t we?”

Co.Owner”Eh i dunno”

Tramp”Aye sure we are”

I swear to god he was up to his neck in Domestos again.

Great result last night. Nice goal by Lucas and also the 50-50 challenge he won that set up the 4th goal. Brilliant.

I still think we are limited when Lucas and Masch play in the middle of the park. Benfica ran rings around us in the first 15 mins. We couldn’t get a foothold or string 3 passes together. I think Lucas struggles when the opposition puts him under pressure in possession. This is when he’ll go for the safe option and a backwards or short sideways pass will follow. I notice that when he hasn’t got a lot of time and you can see he wants to make a penetrating pass he hesitates or doesn’t play it forcefully enough – what happens then is that he either dwells on it or gives away possession or gives a team mate a hospital ball. Lucas also struggles to create when a team sits deep against us. He isn’t the only one to struggle however when a side parks the bus. Most of our side struggle in that situation especially this season.

Lucas had some good touches last night when we won possession back off Benfica and started a counter attack. I saw some incisive first touch passes from him that showed glimpses of the talent that won him player of the year in Brazil. I just think the Premier League is too fast and physical for him and as a result we don’t see the best of him. Similar to a Veron situation in my opinion.

I agree with Arthur and Aitch in that it wasn’t a vintage performance last night, we pass the ball too slowly most of the time, however we were quite clinical in front of goal. We made the chances count and we defended well. It’s got to be said though – Benfica look a very good side.

Gerrard is still struggling for form in my opinion. Johnson hasn’t looked the same since he came back from injury. He looks very rusty. Carra was annoying me all night. I am getting fed up with the launching every time the ball gets anywhere near him. Sometimes there was no Benfica player near him yet he feels the need to hoof the fucking ball to their goalie time and time again. This is why he never got a run in the England side. His distribution is fucking awful and is getting worse.

This might sound crazy but I thought Torres was poor apart from his 2 goals. The 2nd one was magnificent. It proves that no matter how rubbish he is playing he is always likely to get an important goal and therefore in a game we have to win I wouldn’t be taking him off unless he is injured or the game is already won.

Great performances by Agger, Kyg and Benayoun!

Now it’s away from Anfield that will determine our fate.

As for Agger at left back long term? No I don’t agree. He did a good job there but he is our future at centre half. We just need to bring in a quality left back who is quick, athletic and can cross the ball well. Scouts are gonna have to earn their corn.

Agger long term LB i agree a definate no.

For the rest of the season?Why not.

For me Insua has had a torrid time of late.I like the lad and i`m not having a go but he`s been getting a roasting far too much lately.I`ll put it down to it being his first full season and him being a young lad and what not.I see some potential in him.Maybe he needs to shed some bulk as we`ve discussed in here before.

I think it wouldn`t be such a bad thing if Agger stayed in for the remainder.He`s solid there and is great on the ball also.His distribution is sound.

LB: Well I think Agger is gonna have to be seriously considered if we don’t have the sponds to splash in the summer

Timmy – I used to like Insua and yes there is an argument that he’s been overplayed and that he is young. But his pace (or lack thereof) is huge problem and that isn’t something he can improve upon – he can’t learn how to get quicker!

For the rest of the season I would have Agger at left back yes. Insua has been a bit of a liability in the position recently. That’s not to have a go at the lad or make him out to be a scapegoat. But the fact is he has had a torrid time as you say and if playing Agger there instead makes us stronger (which I think it does) then we should do it.

I think gets beaten in a one on one too easily. Takes too long to turn and lacks pace. Full backs need to be athletic because they have to do a lot of turning, changing of direction and they do a lot of running. Last season Insua seemed to be a more mobile and athletic player than what he has shown this season. That extra bulk was not a good idea at all as it’s fucked up his game in my opinion. He should be taken out of the firing line.

Impressive result V a team automatically in next seasons CL.Atletico beat the Reds in August so it will be the toughest game of the 3 sides left.Aurelio is the best option for left back, Agger , to a certain extent would be wasted out wide.

Burgerman: I think Aurelio just got injured again while playing chess…

Arthur, Agger at left back next season is just another square peg in a round hole in my opinion. Taking our best centre half to play him at left back. He could potentially get roasted as well. Centre halves don’t usually like being isolated out wide with a tricky winger. He’d probably be more prone to injury as well because the full back does a lot more running than a centre half. As we’ve just got him fit I think it would be a bad idea to stick him in at left back for a season. I doubt Rafa would do it anyway.

Every time I see Alvez play for Barca I curse Rick Parry. We could have him in our side! £12m Sevilla wanted. He can played at both right and left back. Has played left back for Brazil when Maicon plays at right back.

We got Arbeloa for £2m and he was a very good player. We need another signing like that at left back.

Burgerman, that Aurelio comment is a classic. The guy is injured and out of contract at the end of the season. He has rejected a pay as you play deal so will likely leave the club in June. Recommending him to solve our left back problem is like saying “Put David Burrows in there!”.

Do the winners of the EuroLeague get a place in the CL first rounds? Been trying to find out.

LB totally agree with you regarding carras passing….these crap long balls to no one,even when he has plenty of time have been doing my head in all season…and your right hes getting worse, its not how im used to seeing liverpool play football out from the back. Thats why we need aggar playing in th middle, he was good tho at left back..totally showed what insua’s been lackin all seas.

Great result last night. What pleased me most was it was a team performance rather than the individual brilliance of Stevie or Nando carrying us through (though what can you say about Torres yet again except: brilliant). Everyone played well, done their bit. Credit to Rafa for that too. They were well drilled and looked MOTIVATED. As an unapologetic highlighter of Lucas’ deficiencies, its only fair I add, congrats to the lad on his opening goal of the season. Any tips for the national lads?

Red4Life: They don’t but they should – would really mean the winners take the competition very seriously

When fit(rarely), Aurelio is usually very solid.Kryg lacks pace and is best used V Blackburn, Stoke.Burrows is the wrong side of 40, bet he is still faster than LB!.

I doubt it BM but still I have put on a few lbs recently so its possible.

Well, we’ve just signed the best keeper in the PL for another 6 years! Had to smile at his comments…top man is our Pepe! Future Reds captain for sure.
“My wife told me from the beginning she was more than happy here. My kids enjoy it and they have picked up the Scouse accent already. I am really proud of that.
“In the years ahead they will speak much more Scouse too.”

Arthur @89
Insua “he can’t learn how to get quicker! ” yes he can, speed CAN be taught
Agger I see him as our future CB but versatility is a good thing.
YNWA

Rome77: you mean lose weight???

We need to sign a proper left back end of discussion

Or thats it then end of discussion Arthur has spoken.

King Arthur

red4life #94, to answer your question, unfortunately, no, the champions of the Europa League do not get Champions League qualification. They would have to do so via their own league position, just like everyone else.

I think this is one aspect where UEFA can learn from Asia. There’s two main continental club competitions this side of the world, the AFC Champions League (ACL) and the AFC Cup, and as their names suggests, the ACL is more prestigious. The AFC Cup still manages to attract as the finalists are awarded qualification spots for the following year’s ACL.

Last year my local team made it to the semi-finals of the AFC Cup, and for the first time in ages, the home leg was packed full. Pity they lost in the end, but such was the incentive of Champions League football.

If UEFA could give Champions League spots to the Europa League winner, it will no doubt attract better interest from clubs and fans alike as there is the incentive of the more lucrative Champions League football for them.

“end of discussion” ???

WTF????

Really?????

Oh well… that’s saved me a bit of time, though.

Now… What will I do with myself for the rest of the day?

Democracy doesn’t work guys!!! don’t you know that at this stage?

Since the discussion is over”… how about this…

I think the Fulham and Liverpool fans should unite on Sunday with the following chant…

Chelsea, Arsenal, Man United,
You’re not in Europe anymore!
You’re not in Europe, any more!

… just a thought…

How to fix insua…..more speed work less ball watchin,

i’d take his xbox off im for a month and restict his intake to just one pot noodle per week, should do the trick.

Aitch that sound like it would be pretty funny only problem is thier fans might start singin liverpool aint in europe next year. lol

LB – just to take you up on a couple of points about Lucas.

I agree with you about Lucas not being great under pressure. He does seem a bit flimsy and one-paced on the ball and trips over himself a bit however I believe the major factor here is the lack of options around him for a player like him.

Players need to move and create space and for whatever reason this simply does not happen often enough with us.
I’m inclined to think there is an element of Rafa’s coaching (i.e the defensive responsibility mentality emphasis or the rigid system approach etc) involved here. (I accept that I personally have never attended a Rafa coaching session by the way !).
However, for whatever reason, there seems a lack of willingness/spontaneity/ability to create space and as a result create doubt in the minds of the opposition, hence space, as they back off to over what they imagine might happen….thus pressure is also released. A positive equation.

To illustrate what could be happening look at the second goal last night. Lucas scored it, (unexpected run, thus completely missed by the Benfica defense).
Stevie played a great ball to him, fair enough, nothing too unexpected there but he got the room because Benny Onion made an unexpected move in midfield where he turned and took 2 men out of it in a flash thus making the space for Stevie to slide it through.
The key to the goal was Benny showing for the ball, his quickness of mind and foot which completely destabilised the defensive midfield of Benfica. Lucas himself then applied the coup de grace by not being Nando (to be expected) and hey presto the tie was ours.

My broader point is our midfield and attacking links, be they fullbacks or The “Stevie in the pocket” man just are not providing options either for Lucas (or Masher).
So people say Lucas takes too much time on the ball, well could it be he does because frequently there is no-one providing intelligent options or decoy runs?
Actually if you analyse Lucas’s ability he is very good at playing sharp one touch 10-30m forward passes and they are crisp and very accurate. He’s not as good at safe predictable sideways / backwards passes he gets slated for, in my opinion. He often weighs the easy (slow) pass wrongly (as does Kuyt) and gave the ball away quite a lot last night for example.

I think we have not seen the best of him in a Liverpool shirt simply because we don’t play to his strengths, laughable as that may seem to the Lucas sceptics. I think, for example he would be much more at home in a team like Benfica (as you would probably agree LB) but because they play a fast, technical pass & move game not necessarily just because there is less physical pressure around .
We generally don’t aspire to that type of football as most clubs in England don’t either. Athleticism, power and percentage play are cornerstones of the English game and psyche. Wit, pace on the ball and vision are less so and Lucas, though not the most technically gifted brasilian has those qualities bred into him.
What he has done has been to develop strongly his defensive anticipation and improve his strength and more importantly his tackle timing. More power to him for this.
What does anyone think ?

I’m surprised that Insua is being written off after one full season playing rather consistently. People seemed to have forgotten that he’s played almost every game and he’s still young, meaning that there’s much room to learn and improve.

For the left back discussion, we need to get a new one, as Agger is better suited for central defence. My view is that he and Ninja are our preferred partnership and we’ll see them giving Carra the challenge next season.

Which is (I think) why Carra recently gave an interview stating he would not leave LFC for first team football, as he too, saw it.

Some good points Dougle. I see what you mean with options on the ball and our lack of movement and creating of space.

I do think though that Lucas either takes too long to make a pass or lacks the confidence to make it incisively. I see slight hesitation from him at times in this regard. Compare that to Alonso who would make a pass before anyone else watching would realise it was on. It could just be an 8 yard first time reverse to someone who then realises they are in space. I have seen Aquilani do this as well – a quick pass to someone who didn’t even expect the ball and found themselves in space to advance forward. Aquilani gives the ball away a lot of the time attempting these passes but he looks to be the kind of player that will keep attempting them.

Kuyt also takes ages to decide what pass or option he is going to take. A lot of times he chooses the wrong option. In fact a lot of his best work comes when he only has one option such as the ball running away from him or running out of play so he has no choice but to dig out a cross right on the byline (this sets up Torres at Old Trafford).

In reality though we are not really a pass and move team. We’re more of an Italian style team with British endeavor and this has been the case since Houllier took over from Roy Evans.

Rafa’s philosophy is the Milan style of the late 80s. Wonderful team, great players and successful but their football wouldn’t make you cream your pants like Clough’s Forest or Dalglish’s Liverpool or Wenger’s Arsenal or the present Barca.

Appreciate it if someone can share the link to watch the game tomorrow via the internet. Not showing live in malaysia.thank you.

This fella’s not real,

http://www.mirrorfootball.co.uk/news/Sir-Alex-Ferguson-reignites-his-feud-with-Bayern-Munich-by-branding-them-bullies-before-launching-an-amazing-attack-at-the-disgusting-media-read-the-remarkable-press-conference-in-full-article386743.html

did any of you guy’s see Valencia waving an imaginary card at the ref cos i’m sure i did.

great win for the lads. fuckin awesome to get that 4th goal and spend the last minutes of the game relaxing with beer, rather than pacing around behind the sofa swearing and sweating.

LB, love your work mate! completely agree with your comments all-round, especially carra’s passing and lucas’s unease under pressure.

it’s odd that a couple of posters have felt the need to gloat that lucas’s first goal of the season is now proof that he’s a dangerous attacking midfielder. as arthur said, “1 swallow does not make a summer” and to claim that his critics have now been embarrassed by 1 goal, and should now bow down to their greater wisdom is some kind of fresh madness. if carra belted 1 into the top corner from the edge of the box, would that then be proof that he’s a top-class attacking player?? hmmmm.

not having a go at the lad, who had a decent (not amazing) game and i’m absolutely delighted for him to finally stick one in. just having a go at axchoice and aitch for weird smugness and bizarre logic:). no spite or malice lads. you’d do the same to me.

as LB points out, lucas often looks rushed, indecisive, uneasy and lacking in vision. when i criticise him, i’ve never claimed that he “sits in front of the back 4 and never gets forward”, i’ve said that he can’t finish well, and he doesn’t make enough incisive passes. yup, he finished very well last night, but he still looked uneasy, indecisive and lacking in vision, so you can focus on whatever you like. i choose to focus on that side of his game because i believe the way forward for lfc is to have masch paired with a visionary, goal-scoring player i.e SG or aqua. those who choose to focus on his heart, spirit, and commitment are completely right and he has those qualities in abundance and he is a fine player. i want more though.

as for agger on the left, agree that it might be a good idea for the remainder of the season, but long term, i see agger at centre-half as one of our most exciting prospects and i think he could become a legend. such composure on the ball, the way he drifts past players, his shot, his long passing (especially when compared to carra’s – jeezus, he’s playing like he’s ready for the glue factory).

hats off to rafa once more. i’ve always known he can pull performances out of the bag, and i’ve always kept the faith that he’s going to do it every week. faith gets tested after a season like this, even gerry’s.

Redman, he has taken the defeat with all the grace that I would expect from him. Enjoying every fuckin single moment of it in this freak of a season.

has anyone read the tramps comments about the “mist of venom” he feels surrounds his club from the english press? for the love of buddha! he should step into rafa’s shoes for a season. that man never fails to amaze me with his slanted views. his team receives nothing but unwarranted praise from mindless sycophants, not to mention constant beneficial refereeing, while our club gets kicked in the head and glassed in the face by the press and refs every time we spill a drink, and do we hear rafa bleating on about it? what an utter cunt that man is.

just to clarify, my previous comments on lucas are not a go at him, simply a preference for SG or aqua in that position. that’s all.

on the subject of aquilani, is he ever going to be given a run of games in the same way that crouch and keane were? i’ve criticised rafa for his handling of those 2 players, but at least he gave them a run of starts before he started neglecting them. i get the feeling aquaman might never be given the chance to show what he can really offer us. hopefully i’m wrong and next season we’ll see him given a real go at it, but i feel really sorry for the guy. these little patches of football he’s given are hidings to nothing. he’s trying to show that he can offer the team vision and guile, but in attempting to show that, he’s constantly giving the ball away and looking like square wheel. i can’t wait to see a confident, relaxed and secure aquilani, but who knows if we ever will.

just noticed theredman’s already pointed out the tramps cuntish graceless ways. still, worth saying again…. what a cunt.

Sambo, I think your Aquilani worries are premature. It seems clear to me that Rafa wants to treat the player very carefully and not risking any severe injuries his first season in England. We don’t know the full story here, what the medical team has been saying and so forth, so it would be wrong to conclude Rafa leaves him out of the starting eleven because he doesn’t trust in his ability. Rafa has said on several occasions Aquilani is a quality player but that we probably won’t see the best of him until next season.

What exactly is wrong with the way Rafa treated Crouch? He brought him to Liverpool, which he was criticized for, with a lot of people claiming the player was no where near good enough for our club. Despite the fact that Crouch had a difficult start of his first season, Rafa supported him and gave him numerous opportunities to prove himself, which he finally did. He became a very important player for Liverpool, the critics went silent, but it was obvious we needed another striker with pace, more efficient than Craig Bellamy.

In comes Fernando Torres, a signing that was also met with criticism, as it was claimed that despite his obvious talent he just wouldn’t score enough goals and wasn’t worth £20m. The critics are instantly proven wrong this time as we all remember. Torres is more or less sublime from day one, and has the ability both to overcome defenses with pace, create chances on his own and finish most clinically. That meant Crouch would naturally play a smaller part than previously. I don’t think any decent manager would have preferred Crouch ahead of Torres.

Still he remained an important player and ended up appearing in 36 games that last season, compared to 49 and 47 his first two seasons. He made it clear he wouldn’t accept being a “squad player” in this way, and what was Rafa supposed to do about this other than try to convince him to accept the situation? I just can’t see what his fault was in this case. It annoys me that some people keep blaming Rafa for not keeping a hold of Crouch.

Robbie Keane on the other hand, is a different story. I don’t think Rafa would have sold him back to Spurs so quickly had he wanted to sign him in the first place, but at the end of the day only Rafa, Rick Parry and a few others know the full story of this unfortunate affair. Was Keane treated unfairly by Rafa? I would say probably, but it annoys me that only he is accused of this and not the saint himself Mr Harry Redknapp, who sends him away to Scotland on loan. Nothing wrong with that man management, it would seem.

i didn’t mean to re-open the crouch debate. i’ve said all i’ve got to say on that front and there’s no point repeating it. you obviously haven’t read my previous comments on the matter because i agree with and acknowledge all the points that you make, but have other grievances about the way he wasn’t subbed on when opportunities were there. can’t be bothered going into it again.

i’m more interested in what will happen with aquilani now. i hope you’re right and next season will be his year to shine.

Sambo,

I’m so sick of people simply coming in and using Lucas as a scapegoat whenever results are bad, but refusing to give him any credit. That’s why I did the other extreme, hopefully to show the Lucas bashers how I feel about knee jerk reactions, which I’m glad you pointed it out.

At least Arthur acknowledged he’s a good player, and I’ve also agreed with him that if Aquilani is fully fit and Gerrard back to form, the Lucas-Masch partnership should not be the first choice.

could anybody verify or expand on this

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2010/apr/11/liverpool-fulham-rafael-benitez

axchoice,

the ‘lucas-bashers’ as you call them are generally saying exactly the same thing as you, that he’s a good player but shouldn’t be in our first XI when attacking football is required. even digger (who seems to get everyone’s backs up when he comments on lucas) is usually only saying that he shouldn’t be in the side when we need to attack. i don’t remember him ever saying lucas is shit or anything of the sort. can you recall any actual lucas-bashing that’s been posted lately? i can’t. it’s just people stating preferences for a more attacking and creative line-up.

there’s a weird defensiveness that comes over a few of you whenever the lad’s name is mentioned. i reckon lucas is an excellent squad player, and could even displace masch one day if he continues to improve the way he has. all season long i’ve been calling for lucas to be dropped to the bench and for gerrard to slot into alonso’s old position. that’s nothing against lucas, but it’s always taken that way.

axchoice mate, you get unnecessarily defensive when he gets criticised, you got unnecessarily smug when he scored his first goal of the season, and now you’re contradicting yourself by saying he wouldn’t be in your first XI anyway, which is exactly what arthur, digger, and others have been debating.

so can i just clarify your point? you don’t think he’s good enough to start most games ahead of more creative players, but no one else is allowed to say so. right….. if you agree with this opinion then why spend so much energy retorting angrily to people saying exactly the same thing?

the lucas debate just keeps going round and round and it’s getting fairly tired now. the problem is that every time someone mentions him they’re accused of not watching the game properly or dealt some other patronising mockery. maybe if we can all just agree that lucas/masch shouldn’t be starting every game, we can finally put this whole debate to bed.

Most of us have felt that Lucas is just not good enough to play for Liverpool, but I feel he must be given credit for his performance (not just his finish that Torres would have been proud of) agianst Benfica on Thursday night. This was without doubt his most convincing performance in a red shirt to date. Let’s hope he keeps it up now.

I thought Mascherano was awesome in that game, but the performances of Kuyt, Lucas, Benayoun and Agger were not far behind either.

It’s nice to be able to say that those players mentioned above put in performances that were, in my opinion, better than the all round performances of Gerrard and Torres (despite the latter’s excellent two goals)

Not bad for a two-man team!

Hi Gerry great blog. Looking for a win in tonight’s game. It is not shown in Malaysia, as YK Leong mentioned. Any ideas to watch it?

INteresting analysis of the Blunders committed by the Referee at Benfica a fortnight ago.

http://www.thisisanfield.com/2010/04/03/referee-analysis-benfica-2-1-liverpool/

Good link Knight,
nice to see Rome77 in there.

knight & YKLeong

It is shown live here: http://myp2p.eu/

SOAK, Many thanks!

Sambo,

Please look at the blog comments for the entire season, not just the last two. I’m surprised you said all of you Lucas bashers think he’s a good player, when what I’ve heard is that he’s lousy and not Liverpool material, whatever that means.

Bad results are naturally attributed to him and Rafa’s persistence in selecting him, continually ignoring Gerrard’s loss of form until recently and the injury crisis (Masch’s loss of form in until after Argentina qualified). That is exactly what I’m against: finding a scapegoat to nail Rafa on.

The reason why Lucas is used less now are (1) our injury crisis has finally eased, and (2) Gerrard finally gaining some form, trnaslating into Rafa has more choices to operate who he wants in midfield. He may not be in the first choice midfield but he’s still selected in important games BTW.

Things are not so simple like Lucas + Masch = Defensive Midfield, as the Benfica, Mancs (last season OT, this season Anfield), Lille (at Anfield) results have shown.

Because of the number choices available, the Lucas-Masch partnership will not be the first choice, but can still be deployed depending on the opponents we are facing. And if he develops his attacking game, then why not?

Another thing to add: Alonso is no longer with us, and no one can in this squad play as well as Alonso (even Gerrard) in the ‘Alonso’ position you mentioned. Our midfield has to work out the best balance to win games, playing in a different way.

I’d like to end this Lucas debate as well. I think I’ve seen your point.

Oh dear. Torres is out.

Lineup is:
Reina, Johnson, Carragher, Kyrgiakos, Agger, Mascherano, Aquilani, Babel, Maxi, Gerrard, Ngog.

Subs: Cavalieri, Kuyt, Benayoun, Lucas, Degen, Pacheco, Ayala.

Interesting one here. Come on you Reds!

Anyone know a good site for streaming?

http://myp2p.eu

Kiss 4th goodbye.

SOAK,
thanks for the link, first time i have watched the boys on my comp, unfortunately it was a classic bus parkers match and the way they congratulated each other at the final whistle i thought they had knocked Barca out of the champions league.
As Lb say’s “kiss 4th goodbye” but i already had as i conceded that at the end of the Birmingham game, let’s face it if the rolls were reversed and we had 4pts more than city and a game in hand on them (before todays games) i would feel pretty comfortable about finishing 4th.
Let’s not be despondendant, we have Athletico next and we may face them boring cunts(fulham) in the Europa final, cos as i said in an earlier comment i am fed up to the back teeth wishing and hoping this season, so the sooner it fucks off the better.

I wholeheartedly agree with you redman – let’s get it over and done with and wipe the slate clean. Hopefully we can bring the uefa silverware home as a bit of compensation.

My other form of solace is watching the mancs go out of CL and now it seems they’ve lost out on the title – I’d feel better gloating if our boys had done the job today but fuck it. The icing on the cake would be arse leapfrogging them but I don’t know, they’re getting into a right state with injuries.

Todays game was a frustrating affair to say the least and Rafa didn’t really lift my spirits with his first substitution. I thought Ngog looked out of his depth all game long but he goes and pulls off Aqua, who had actually been the most industrious and even looking likely to break the deadlock.

After quite a bit of soul searching I have come to the conclusion that I want him to stay on as gaffer. Don’t see any better options around and want to give him a chance to redeem himself, we owe him that and a lot, lot more. Hopefully we can scrape together a bit of cash for some reinforcements and perhaps the youth system will bear some fruit – Pacheco looked hungry and up for it when he came on and is definitely one for the future. In the end we might have to hope Rafa actually wants to be a part of that future…

Didnt watch the match but just got home and checked teh news on skysports website ..

cant believe that we lost despite 69% possession and 17 shots on/off target compared to just 1 by fulham …

sorry .. meant DREW* ….

Its obvious what’s let us down this season and its the lack of goals.And i think in the summer when the window closed
And we had not signed a proven goalscorer the dye was cast.We knew if torres was injured(which he often is) our only cover was ngog and kuyt.

Steven Gerrard does not enter the argument because he is a attacking midfielder(albeit a brilliant one)but he cannot lead the line.

That leaves us with Kuyt a honest hard working
runner that will die for the cause who started his
liverpool career as a centre forward.

But was deemed not good enough surely his most ardent supporters would admit that.

Bearing in mind he has played most of his career as a centre forward and the fact he is a dutch international player he should be the ist player we turn to when torres is out injured or in need of a rest.

But its like the elephant in the room(an English idiom for an obvious truth that is being ignored or goes unaddressed).

Kuyts not good enough he lacks pace ,his ist touch is not at a level i expect from a liverpool forward ,and his goalscoring record is poor and was poor even when he played as our main striker.

And now ngog who seems to get the nod when Torres
does not play because of the reasons i gave above.

A young anelka without the raw pace that scares the shit out of lumbering centre halves.

A 6 out of 10 performer at on his best day at the moment a trier who gives his all but we need more than a 6 out of 10 centre forward

I feel bad for the guy its like just getting out of drama school and being understudy for lawrence olivier in king lear.Too much too soon and the comparison is always going to be unfavourable.

If we don’t get the money soon to buy the players we need to compete with the new top four :man utd ,chelsea,arsenal,man city.We will be struggling to get into the top six.

We had a opportunity with the signing of torres to move beyond the likes of arsenal but i feel its slipping away quickly.

THE END IS NIGH

YNWA

The main reason we are considered a 2 man team is
when it matters the 2 men in question are our only regular goal threat.

When opposing teams see the liverpool team sheet the only 2 players that concern them are gerrard and torres we lack a serious goal threat beyond these 2 players.

Babel could be a serious threat if he gets a extended run in the team.It’s got to be easier to turn babel into a team player who helps out defensively and is a goal threat.

Than turn kuyt into a player who strike fear into the minds of men.

In my opinon our best players who we should build the team/squad for next season around are.
Reina,johnson,agger,mascherano,gerrard,benayoun,torres,babel.

Gerrard should revert back to central midfield.Benayoun should play behind torres i think he would excel in the role.Babel should get the right wing position.We keep playing him on the left without success(he’s right footed).

Just need to buy a leftback,leftwinger,centrehalf three top quality signings and a striker to cover el nino and we’ll be set

Easy peasy lemon squeezy as we use to say

YNWA

Well that’s it – in league terms our season is finally over. What a shambles 2009/10 has been and it has to be up there with 1993-94 & 2002/03 as our worst since the inception of the Premier League (considering our strength of squad on paper).

Torres out injured (AGAIN) and with him sure to be played throughout all of Spain’s games in the summer, I really fear we may never see El Nino play at a high level for the Reds again

HUGE summer ahead. Will Rafa stay, walk out or be pushed out? Will we have new/same owners? Will we have any cash? Will we be able to keep Gerrard, Mascherano and Torres?

Depressing times. Who would have thought we’d be in this position after the end of last season?

obviously that should have been

Ain’t going to go into a big one here but we played really well for most of the game but did not have the cutting edge / intelligence to get one goal. One would have become 3/4 no problem.
We needed just one to go in.

I liked Aquaman. He played well and sparkled. I also liked Special k as an attacking heading threat. Babel flitted in and out. I agree with rafamuffin that Babel should be tried on the right. Seems to make sense as all he ever does is cut in on the left.
Of course this could upset Dirk’s spot but, against bus parkers in particular, it would be good to have unfettered pace as well as the subtle skills of a Benny. I also agree with rafamuffin as far as Benny in the hole behind Torres. He has better touch and more craft than Stevie and is often no-where on the wing. I know he’s been injured as well but his form has not been good this calender year at all.
Agger was competent,i liked that he shot and offers that threat. The back 4 were grand but they had nothing to do.
Someone should cut JC hamstrings so that he cannot pass more than 10 yards. Man sooooo much ball to no-where every game.

As for Fulham. A masterclass in defensive football…. if that’s what turns you on. I guess Roy was just doing a shadow run for Hamburg. They would not be easy to beat at all. But first we gotta get there.

To sum up, we could and should have won, played well and got no reward or luck. At least now we can focus on something we can attain. That’s a bit of luck for us all, Rafa included.

Rafamuffin
When i used to play on the LW i always scored more goals with my right foot than on the RW ( the graveyard shift ) were i got more assists, as i used to keep drifting to the corner flag and end up crossing. Which is what a winger should be doing but Babel wants to be scoring the goals so the LW allows him to cut in and shoot with his right foot like Gerrard for England its playing to his attacking strengths, but weakens his defensive capabilities (which ain’t that good anyway) unlike Kuyt whose sacrificed that need to score and doesn’t mind putting a cross in while also been strong in defence which helps Johnson who needs it because when he gets forward down the RW he cuts in and shoots with his left and plays to his attacking strengths but he pays for it when tracking back because he’s left footed. ( If Rafa was as defensive as some make out he’d play him at LB.)
YNWA

As for the game when Torres didn’t play i expected a 0 -0 or 1-0 as i knew Fulham would play the 10 man defence but with a bit of luck one one of the many shots would have won it for us but it wasn’t to be and like Dougle says for them it was just a dress rehearsal for the Europa cup without showing us any of their attacking strategies. I actually think they’d of been happy to practice at stopping Torres even if it meant losing but make no mistake if they reach the final they wont play like that but then again if we reach the final and Torres plays we wont be getting a result like that.
Arthur
“Who would have thought we’d be in this position after the end of last season?”
No not me, but if you said end of last August then yes i did, as Rafamuffin said the die was cast when the last chance for G&H to redeem themselves by investing in the squad past by with the closing of the Transfer period.
They was already on thin ice before that as regards to the stadium, so for me it was the final straw.
YNWA

The thought of potentially finishing 7th is just unbearable. Man City have 4 tough games in a row and hope they’ll falter….as well as Spurs.

very difficult, leong.

I’m caught in the dilemma of who I want to win the Manchester Derby.

I always felt we would nick a goal before the final whistle but alas we did not.

Read that Barclays is still in discussions with us and will soon take over our debts and values us much more than 500M. I really really hope this becomes a reality and we see the end of the two clowns saga. If I understood it rightly, Rafa said something like keeping the spine of the team and buying at least 4 quality players i.e.: +20M each. Keeping my fingers and toes crossed for this.

No problems theredman, and knight, soon we could start subcribing to iptv and hopefully do not have to depend on Astro anymore.

Ax – I think we can all safely start cheering City on Saturday.

Arthur,

I think the same way too, after discussing with my fellow LFC supporting friend.

As long as Chelsea beat Bolton tomorrow night (insurance against Mancs winning the Prem) I actually want United to beat City on Saturday, with Chelsea beating Spurs on the same day.

We are clutching at straws now, but if Chelsea can secure the Prem before they visit Anfield, this could help us too.

Let’s hope Nando’s knee injury is not serious and that he is back against West Ham, otherwise none of the above will matter!

Rome i have always understood why babel prefers to play on the left.

The problem is so do all the premier league right backs who know exactly what his game plan is and show him down the left.

When this happens he has no plan b and ends up running into traffic and losing the ball.

Where as down the right his pace would create more service for the centre forward with crosses into the box and best of all get defenders running towards there own goal which they hate doing

YNWA

I see some people are still trying to work out the permutations of results and how they will affect us and our rivals.

Whats the point if we cant beat the likes of birmingham and fulham when we were desperate for
a win.

Those games were shit or bust games,and i’m afraid we bust

YNWA

Forget permutations. Our league campaign is over. Not sure I care much about the Europa League either.

I’d like to know what’s going on with this Barclays Bank situation and the restructuring of the board with an interim chairman who happens to be a Chelsea season Ticket holder. I read in the ECHO that RBS have given Hicks & Gillet yet another 6 month deadline to sell the club.

The whole thing is a fucking shambles from top to bottom both on and off the pitch.

I can see things turning very nasty, very quickly. Another 6 months is 6 months too long for all of us at this stage. But knowing how the LFC charade will play itsefl out – I’m sure those money grabbing Bush-loving cunts will probably try and cling on that little bit longer

Could be a rough few seasons lads…

couldn’t see the game as it wasn’t shown here in new zealand. how was aqua? did he look more settled and composed? fucking typical, i’m desperate to see the man play and sky tv doesn’t air one of his rare starts.

Aqui was shattered after 63 mins when he came off.He had a few shots b4 hand, that lacked pace and accuracy.The game was shown on Canal Plus 2, may be online.2 new strikers is the first priority and may be financed by selling Benny and Kuyt.Ged scored 67 and 69 points in his first 2 seasons and the most we can get this year is 68!.
The Reds have scored few goals from outside the box in the Prem, another shortcoming in the side.Fifth @ best.

Just read article this in the Times….
Royal Bank of Scotland has said that it may extend its loans to Liverpool to help the club’s unpopular American owners to sell it.

It emerged over the weekend that Tom Hicks and George Gillett Jr have abandoned plans to sell a minority stake to Rhône Capital, an American private-equity firm, instead appointing Barclays Capital to sell the club completely. Hicks and Gillett are expected to end their ill-fated relationship with the Merseyside club within the year.

But unless Liverpool can secure a deal with the lenders, the club faces an imminent cash crisis. The club has £237 million of outstanding loans with RBS and Wachovia, the American bank, which expire in July. The Times has learnt that RBS has indicated that it will grant a six-month extension of the loan provided that the American owners can convince the bank’s board by July that they genuinely intend to sell.

This is the third time that Hicks and Gillett have put Liverpool up for sale, but the pair have so far failed to find buyers willing to meet their £500 million valuation. It was unclear yesterday whether Wachovia, with whom Liverpool has 25 per cent of the loan, would grant a similar extension

The American bank has taken a much tougher line than RBS and very nearly refused to refinance the club last July when its previous loan expired. The two banks ultimately agreed to grant Liverpool a 12-month extension, but warned Hicks and Gillett that they would not get another refinancing deal unless they reduced Liverpool’s debt by £100 million.

The pair began talks with investors about raising the cash in January, but abandoned plans to sell a minority stake after a deal with Rhône Capital fell apart last week. Rhône had offered £100 million for a 40 per cent stake, but Hicks and Gillett, who paid £219 million for the club in 2007, balked at cutting their stakes to 30 per cent each.

The Americans appear to have finally accepted that they must sell the club to raise the cash to pay off Liverpool’s banks. State-backed RBS, for whom the club is a political hot potato, is likely to keep the pressure on Hicks and Gillett to sell.

Liverpool are set to confirm later this week that they have brought in Martin Broughton, the British Airways chairman, as the club’s new chairman. That appointment is intended to reassure potential buyers and the club’s banks that this latest attempt to sell Liverpool is genuine. Broughton’s appointment, it is understood, is designed to give the club “credibility” with bidders.

It is believed that Barclays Capital has already received a number of serious expressions of interest. The Rhône Capital deal would have valued the club at £250 million but independent valuations have put Liverpool’s worth at closer to £300 million.

Lads,
A question for you to ponder. Assuming we won’t be making 4th spot (i will cling to the possibility until its mathematically impossible!!) who thinks we’d be better off finishing outside the european places completely? No thursday games against eastern european teams, fully concentrate on the league and 2 domestic cups? Just a thought I had and wonder what you guys think.

I remember hearing something about the 4th and 5th placed teams got to play off for a spot in the CL. Any ideas?

I’m afraid that won’t be the case SOAK.

galwayred, A blessing in disguise hopefully, at least without CL.

With the world cup we will never know when the players would be back in form afterwards. Fourth placing would mean the playoff games and with so many of our players involved in the WC, it will be interesting to see if we could give a worthy performance in the playoffs with players being tired and overplayed, not to mention if injured. Not that I don’t trust us to beat the teams in the playoffs because on our day we can beat any team.

It will also take some time, presumably, before the new players, if any, could really settled well in the team but I guess Rafa will take these into account when deciding the players.

If we go out of the CL or the lesser EL (that’s it if we qualify) early, we could then allow ourselves to concentrate domestically. Number 19 is much much more precious. And who knows, without the CL income, the two clowns will be forced to leave eh..

Still clutching at straws, that’s me LB

Forget about clutching at straws lads – we’re cooked

As for next season, to Europa or not to Europa. It is a revenue stream (albeit not remotely as large as Big Cup) but money nonetheless so I suppose we should hope to get into it

I think it’s gonna be one of the most turbulent pre-seasons in LFC history. And we’re really not sure if it’ll be a happy ending or not

I see Aquilani was badly missed at Roma

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/blog/2010/apr/12/roma-internzionale-serie-a

Now Roma are top I reckon they will bottle it.

A last minute sms sent me to The Cobra Club to watch the game live, with satellite from a South African channel.

We had lots of shots on goal, but these were weak shots, or not well taken or both. Full marks to Fullham who defended well, putting literary their whole team in front of goal except their lone striker, Zamora.
Gotta disagree with earlier comments about Aquilani. He gave away the ball so many times, I don’t have enough fingers on my two hands to count them. Lucas would have done better, IMHO.

I hate to say this but I agree with Bugerman for once. Best result is fifth, especially after watching Man Shitty beat the shit out of the team we drew 1-1 with a week ago, Birmingham.

Their strikers are a delight to watch: Adebayor, Tevez, Bellamy, Jo, Benjani and Rocket Santa Cruz.

Their backs are formidable: : Joleon Lescott (ENG) Sylvinho (BRA) Wayne Bridge (ENG) Micah Richards (ENG) Kolo Toure.

Their Midfielders astounding: Gareth Barry (ENG) Patrick Vieira (FRA) Nigel de Jong (NED) Stephen Ireland (IRL) Michael Johnson (ENG) Vincent Kompany (BEL) Martin Petrov (BUL) Shaun Wright-Phillips (ENG).

This is forth position team to me this year. And, sadly, that means we end up Fifth, at best. Sigh!

And so we go on to the new season.Here are three scenarios:

Lucky strike: New owner/s by July with plenty of money. Rafa is given Stg100 million to buy players and not having to sell to buy.

Most likely story: New owners by July with some money for Rafa but only Stg 50 million. He has to sell in order to buy above the Stg 50 million.

To sell: Aquilani, Insua, Reira, Aurelio.
To buy: David Villa and Silva

Most dreaded scenario: We don’t have new Buyers. Surprise, surprise. H&G forces the sale of SG, Torres, Benayoun and Mascherano to appease RBS and Wachovia with Stg150 million with their debt reduction. Rafa leaves.

Let us hope for the best. Do not worry. In times of great trouble, there are always great opportunities. YNWA.

knight//

Do you really think selling Aquilani and Insúa is part of a most likely scenario this summer? If Rafa stays? These are players he has either shown or said have a great future at Liverpool. We were signing Aquilani for five years and won’t see the best of him until next season. I think his few appearances have shown a lot of promise, but still he hasn’t quite adapted to the English game.

If he had been a less injury prone player he would have fully adapted by this time and probably being at the top of his game. I say it’s extremely unlikely he would be offloaded this summer, even if Rafa would get the sack. Perhaps some pundits would claim otherwise, but that only makes it more unlikely as I see it.

Babel, Riera and Aurelio are the most likely players to be offloaded if (as I assume) we still have to bring in a certain amount of cash in order to use the same amount (at most) to buy new players. Even with new investments I suppose Riera and Aurelio will leave. Apparently Valencia are still in an even worse financial condition than us, so unless something changes there I can’t see them holding on to Villa and Silva for another summer. Those two players would have been the perfect addition to complete our squad last summer.

LB, did you notice how some of those quoted figures are new amounts?

I’ve read quite a few articles about the situation over the weekend… most of them quote different amounts… and many of them are obviously just pieced together from previously written articles on the subject…

What I’ve been able to gleen is this…

1. Appointing Martin Broughton has been quoted as a “short-term appointement” similar to Christian Purslow’s.
Purslow was brought in on a short term contract with a mandate to find investment.
Broughton is to be brought in on a short term contract, with a mandate to find a new investor (either partial, or a take-over.)
…HOWEVER…

I’ve also read 2 articles (from financial sources… one was bloomberg, I forget the other) that Broughton’s appointment is exactly the kind of move unpopular owners (of any corporation) make, so they can slip into the background and continue running the club, with someone else as the “face” of the company. (in other words this has been done before and is tried and tested!)
… now that in and of itself wouldn’t be scary… BUT…
… Barclays have supposedly put forth an offer to refinance the RBS loan… to the tune of 300 million.

Now taking into account that that the RBS loan is supposedly 237 million…
…and that the amount being rumored for new investment, in all the broadsheets, is 60 million…
…you do the math…

G&H appoint Broughton… borrow 300 million from Barclays… pay off RBS (who remember, are dictating terms and rumored to be attempting to force a sale)… and do what they did when we bought Torres, Babel and a few others… borrow the summer warchest!!!

In this scenario…
A. Rafa might have a few bob to spend, but…
B. The Yankls are still in charge, we just don’t see or hear them! …and…
C. We go from 237 million… back UP to 300 million in debt (and those figures may not be accurate)

2.
In the above mentioned financial articles, it was also suggested that while the RBS debt was at 237 million (actual figures may vary;) ) this was the debt held by Kop Holdings.
It was suggested that there was an additional 100 million of debt on the actual club itself.
(Again… while not proof of a conspiracy, an interesting coincidence that this is the figure we’ve been trying to squeeze out of the Rhone Group AND the figure RBS appear to be demanding in July?)

Now what is scary about this though… was the next part of the article which went something like this…

Scenario A – The Yanks can sell the club outright … but if they do that, then they have to pay off the debts held… and therefore walk away with very little.

Scenario B – The Yanks sell Kop Holdings to “new owners” and in this scenario, they walk away with all the money, as new owners acquire not only Kop Holdings, but all its actual holdings… which in this case, is LFC AND the RBS loans (and of course, any debt that might be on the club)

Apparently… in financial circles, its actually better to have debt, than capital, so this isn’t the batshit-crazy scenario it would appear to you or I…
(this process of buying and selling debt… as opposed to capital assets… is how blokes like Donald Trump made and lost and made back his fortune several times.)
(it is also the process… bastardized and mis-used to the Nth degree… that led to the global meltdown.)

I don’t claim any inside knowledge here… but what’s being written in may of the papers, is largely inaccurate… don’t just read one article and buy into it.
Look for the loopholes…
… the regurgitated quotes and misquotes…
… ask yourself, does the math add up?

3. On Friday, I read a “comment” by someone at the bottom of a Times-online article… just a comment by some reader… that said… Moores was an idiot and should have valued the club at 600 million, which DIC would have gladly paid.
(Now there were lots of other factors that went into accepting the G&H bid, but this comment, ignores the fact that while DIC did increase their initial bid, they didn’t significantly out-bid G&H.)
… but that’s beside the point…. the reason I mention it is because this was the first time I have ever read the amount 600 million in relation to Liverpool Football Club.
When DIC came back in for us, it was reported that they offered 400 million. The Yanks then immediately valued LFC at 450, then supposedly 500, and even possibly as high as 550.
But never 600 million.

But on Saturday, there were TWO articles, not one but TWO, that contained this ammount as a possible valuation that G&H had stuck on the club.

Conclusion?
FS is right and hack-lazy-journos simply troll boards looking for shit to write a made-up article around.

Conclusion – depressed !

Great post there Aitch. I can, with some effort, understand some of the most intricate philosophical arguments put forth through history, but I have to admit – the way the financial world works is for the most part beyond my comprehension. Did they deliberately make it so complicated so as to avoid having ordinary people understand what’s going within the institutions they in some respects depend on?

It all just seem like one hell of a mess to me and I fail to understand what our American owners are trying to achieve with their so-called franchising. If all they want is to make a quick buck, than they certainly seem to put themselves through an unnecessary amount of trouble. But none of the turmoil we’ve experienced within our club is unheard of; there are many similar situations within other football clubs.

What’s slightly unusual with the case of Liverpool is that the manager has been involuntarily drawn into the bloody mess in a way I don’t really see at other financially struggling clubs. At least since the club was sold three years ago Rafa has lived through a more or less constant struggle; if it isn’t with the owners (hasn’t been heard of for quite some time now) then it is with the biased media coverage against him and the so-called supporters who buy into it.

No matter what happens with the financial situation at Liverpool the upcoming months, there is no doubt Rafa has a lot more to gain by joining another top European club than to stay with us for the remainder of his contract. Juventus (and possibly even Real Madrid) will most likely try to hire Benítez as their new manager during the summer (before or after the World Cup, I don’t know). I wouldn’t be surprised if they would be willing to compensate the club with some of the cost it would require to release Rafa from his current contract.

If this occurs, we’ll just have to hope the debt situation will be fixed somehow and that someone (Stan Collymore, for instance) can come up with a replacement who does a better job than Rafa. Anyone would probably do, given all the criticism I’ve read and heard more or less since Rafa took over 6 years ago.

Just red blogs 15 and 16 bit of a eye opener.

Note to self read all of the blogs

Also apparently Jamie Carragher would jump ship if he was replaced and left out of the 1st team on a regular basis.
ext
I appreciate carra’s efforts over the years but we need to be ruthless and get rid of players who cannot take us to the next level.

If carra cannot except being a squad player next season then we need to get rid

We should all remember the needs of the club goes before the needs of the individual whoever they are

Nice bit of sarcasm there sachem.

It is absolutely deliberate on the part of financial institutions (and governments).
They make these things convoluted to keep the populace in their place.
A certain amount of success is allowed for… coz that just feeds the masses dreams of someday getting lucky or striking it rich…
…insuring that they behave like good little cogs in the machine, happily going along like lemmings, waiting for their ship to come in.

Governments and financial ministers are very vocal about stating they never saw the global meltdown coming… but I saw it coming 3 years before it happened, and I don’t have a fuckin degree in econiomics… so they’re either lying to our faces, or complete and utter morons… either way, its not good, since they are at the controls!
Some of the complete and utter bullshit being written about the financial collapses is staggering. They still claim to have not seen it coming… yet they were actively trading in this shit and making money off the failure.

Its like the people who made massive amounts of money trading on 9/10 (in unusual trades) claiming they had no prior knowledge of the attacks… and have avoided any sort of real investigation or prosecution to this day… but they fuckin did, or they wouldn’t have traded when they did or the way they did.

Its not just financial philosophical arguments that are hard for many to understand…
People seem to have the same problem when it comes to football.

And I’m sorry to go there again, but it needs to be said….
Take for instance the people who fail to see the irony… the obvious irony that is… of the posts praising Lucas’ singular goalscoring effort this season.
Clearly not understanding that those comments were made because his every single mistake is all too frequently amplified by others, into the reason we lose or draw various games, when we should (by their argument, and by some divine right, or inclusion of other players) have otherwise won… but for his inclusion in the side, or singled out mistake.

They will come in here and argue that people who support Lucas, don’t understand that Stevie G is fundamentally a better player… by a country mile…
… all the while ignoring that Stevie G has had the worst season he’s ever had in a Liverpool (or any other shirt) for that matter…
…ignoring that SG has this season delivered performances where his pass completion percentage was below 50% while Lucas was abouve 70%
…ignoring games this season, where SG couldn’t trap his nuts in his jockstrap, let alone a fuckin pass from a teammate…
… ignoring games this season where SG simply disappeared for large parts of the game, while Lucas put himself into every tackle, then gave the won ball to a teammate (whether it be 5 yards away, or behind him or not) only for them to then twat it upfield… directly to the opposition…

Nobody is arguing that Stevie isn’t a better footballer… Lucas Leiva’s mum wouldn’t make that argument…
…but this season, Lucas HAS been our best midfield option (over the course of THIS season) in a season when…
Masch went missing,
SG went missing,
Aurellio, despite looking good there once, failed miserably when called upon,
Spearing didn’t step up,
Aqua failed to heal,

Now that Masch is back to his best, and SG is slowly getting back to some form, maybe that argument no longer holds true…. (though we didn’t score when he was replaced this weekend with a “more attacking line-up, so maybe not,) …but that isn’t the argument that has been made, by anyone in the Lucas Support Camp.

Philosophical deabtes are great… and have their place… but they tend to overlook mitigating factors from the real world as it happens.

… Oh… and Sambo, for the record Digger and a fair few others have openly stated, not insinuated mind you, but stated clearly, that they think “Lucas is not good enough for LFC” and that he “wouldn’t make it into any other top 4 side” … as though Fletcher, Carrick, Hargreaves, Anderson… just to pick one of those sides… would walk into LFC… (puhlease!)

… but I digress…

rafamuffin… JC’s contract couldn’t have come at a worse time, really.

Poor season for the team, in which he had a fair few poor displays, colliding with a summer where Rafa’s future is in doubt, and the ownership is up in the air?

I reckon after a holiday, and a summer’s rest, watching the World Cup on a big-screen with his mates, he’ll be raring to go again next season.

He’s only going to get slower as he ages, so its all the more important for him that he stays fit and on form.
The tugs, pushes and little fouls he gets away with now, will start to look more glaringly obvious as he gets older/slower.
But look at Dunne at Villa. I’d say he is having a better season this season, than he did last.

JC can certainly bounce back next season… and he’ll need to to keep his spot. People are all too quick to write players off.
A lot will depend on if Agger stays fit and on form, and Skrtel’s fitness and form, and maybe even Kyrgiakos, who I think has been a revelation in his outings.

But these players (like some fans) can’t have it both ways.
If you want us to sign more and better players… then some fucker’s gonna have to sit wood…

In re: sachems’s point about Rafa and the LFC boardroom turmoil.

I don’t necessarily agree that we are unusual in this respect, this shit goes on at other clubs… maybe to a lesser extent at most, but there’s a few to the extent that it is at LFC… just maybe with not so much publicity.
A few clubs have already gone under.
A dozen or more have managed to weather administration. Portsmouth (the highest profile to date) still need to do that.

But look at Newcy.
People will suggest we are in a different boat… but it ain’t that different.

They’re not in as much debt and only have one knobhead to deal with, as opposed to two, but…
The difference between us and them is that all their managers walked, so there wasn’t the constant battle that Rafa has given the Yanks, for the media to harp on. (what would have happened if Keegan had stayed and fought like Rafa?)

They’ve been a huge success in the Championship, but they had to get rid of some egos and go with a low-key (and by that, I mean not a big name) manager to effect it. (And I read that they drastically restructured salaries as well, which would have killed them before they started.)
But had they avoided relegation…. I think they’d be in far worse trouble now.

(They’ll be the model Portsmouth will surely be looking to???)
(Although did you see their new problem. Now P’mouth have qualified for the FA Cup Final… all sorts of bonuses in player’s contract’s kick in.)

Jesus fuc king christ, i have just read a fair few posts as me net connect has been down…just found out result as i also live on the smaller underbelly of the planet and sky decided to show mank city destroy birmingspam…depresion has set in just read Aitch’s post on our finances, fuck it looks as bad as one of carra’s long balls, still i heard we played ok and aqua got to strech his ankle…hoooray….pacheco was lively…lovely news, torres is injured again, wow …let me just turn the gas on..ahhh thats better…now where did i put those matches??

At least we’re not Portsmouth redkelly.
If they play Pique in one more game… say the FA Cup Final… it triggers a 4 million quid bonus for the lad…
…that’s just one player… and he’s been their main source of goals lately!

And there was an article this morning that claimed a 200k per week player was on his way to the Premier League this summer.
Its fuckin ludicrous, and we’ll end up like the bunged up Italian League.
The Premier League simply can’t keep this up.

Dont even bother Sambo….its pointless…..just let it go….

Great post, Aitch!

I endorse the theory about the yanks hiding behind Martin Broughton and still pulling the ropes from behind the screen. The yanks earlier behaviour (60 days to start building the stadium, We will not be like Man United and use the assets to buy the Club, Klinsmann, bickering publicly with each other, etc) points to a repeat of the same. Meaning, more chaeting.

Aitch @ 177: Like your work, even if Diggs doesn’t

I read a couple of very interesting articles from Dvaid Maddock in the Mirror. I will post them now…

RAFA MUST GET HIS TRANSFER SPENDING RIGHT THIS SUMMER, OR IT WILL BE HEADLINE NEWS.

I’ll let you into a little secret about newspapers. The headline at the top of this column isn’t written by me.

Puzzled? Well, there is a demarcation between the words, which are supposed to inform, enlighten and sometimes infuriate (in no particular order), and the headline, which is basically supposed to advertise.

So someone else reads these words, and then expertly decides upon a headline which best sells them. Obviously, newspapers want their headlines to make the story stand out, and that sometimes means they don’t necessarily represent, completely accurately, the words below.

Now, I’m not complaining about this, because who amongst you would read a story if it had a particularly bland, boring banner across the top of it?

Sometimes newspapers go a little too far and even the writer can’t agree with what has been done (take for instance the Laurel and Hardy gag in Tuesday’s Mirror, just because Liverpool drew a match and for which I apologise to those offended), but by and large, the headline is merely a tool to make the words stand out.

Which is a long-winded way of saying, please don’t be unduly influenced by the headlines, even if they are a little inflammatory. I’m referring, specifically, to the column I wrote a fortnight ago, suggesting that for all Liverpool’s problems in recent years, they still had a chance to emerge as contenders this season, and blew it.

The response I had to that column was almost universal. I’m impressed how many of you replied in defence of Rafa Benitez thinking I had made an all-out attack on him, but I fear most of you missed the point, because of the headline below.

WHY THE OWNERSHIP ISSUE HAS BEEN CLOUDING THE REAL REASON FOR LIVERPOOL’S STRUGGLES THIS SEASON: RAFA BENITEZ

My point was this. Rafa Benitez works under difficult conditions at Liverpool, because of the uncertainty about the ownership, and because of the obvious mistakes the American owners have made since arriving at Anfield.

His job is not easy at the best of times, and recently it has got harder because of the relative lack of investment in signings, due to an economic downturn that has affected just about every top club in Europe bar Real Madrid and Manchester City.

But when he signed a new contract last year, he knew exactly what he was getting himself into, and the conditions he would be operating under. And he also knew he had a team that finished last season just one step away from winning the title.

Since then, the club has done some impressive work under Managing Director Christian Purslow in securing new revenue streams that have allowed players such as Steven Gerrard, Fernando Torres, Dirk Kuyt, Daniel Agger, Glen Johnson and Alberto Aquilani to be signed on massive long-term contracts, with the prospect of Pepe Reina, Javier Mascherano and perhaps Jamie Carragher to soon follow.

In the summer, Liverpool didn’t do much NET spending on players, because they sold Xabi Alonso and Alvaro Arbeloa to finance the £40million purchase of Aquilani and Johnson.

But they secured themselves amongst the top four clubs in the Premier League in terms of wage spending, a position that Liverpool have in fact enjoyed over the past decade.

So when many of you reply to suggest that Benitez has had no money to spend on players and Spurs – for instance – have spent far more on signings in recent seasons, consider this. Tottenham’s highest earner is on less than all the above-named players.

As we know, it is wage spending that dictates where you finish in the league. Liverpool are currently the fourth highest spenders, so should finish fourth. It is easy to work out why. Paying massive wages allows you not only to recruit the top players, but to KEEP them. Tottenham may buy some good players, but if they perform they lose them to the likes of Manchester United.

Soon (this season in fact) Manchester City will pass Liverpool in terms of wages spent, so that presents a massive problem next season because, all other things being equal, Liverpool will finish fifth.

To break out of that cycle of finishing where your wage spending says you should, you have to do everything “perfectly”, as Benitez himself often says. And the point I was making a fortnight ago was this. In the summer, Liverpool – thanks to a fine performance from manager and players last season – were one step away from the title.

They secured their best players on massive new contracts, and through the astute sale of Alonso for an inflated price (thanks again to Purslow), they had £40million to spend on taking that final step to the title.

Had everything been done perfectly, then I believe Liverpool would be challenging for the title right now, particularly because it appears Manchester United have taken a step backwards.

Instead, a mistake was made in signing Aquilani, who clearly wasn’t ready to go straight into the team and influence the title race this season. And I believe a mistake was also made in signing Johnson as an attacking option, when Benitez’s blueprint was an incredibly solid defensive platform.

Johnson is a fine player, but a completely different player to what Benitez had, and built his success on. So it needed (and still needs) time to adjust, but one step away from the title is not the time for that experiment.

Hindsight now tells us that it would have been far better to keep Arbeloa, and use the Alonso money to buy a second striker who would allow Gerrard to drop back into his preferred central midfield role, and a wide player to provide creativity. The second striker could then have covered for Torres’ many injuries, leaving Lucas et al to cover for Gerrard.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing of course, and I don’t want to unfairly condemn Benitez with it. But the fact remains that Benitez was given the chance by Purslow and his financial team to at least challenge, and the steps the manager took in the summer moved Liverpool not towards the title, but towards a scrap for fourth place which they now look unlikely to win.

So Benitez didn’t do things perfectly, even though the club’s financial team – now operating impressively after years of under-performance – have maintained the investment in player contracts to keep Liverpool in the top four.

The manager himself though, often asks the question, are you not allowed one bad year any more? And he’s right. After two Champions League finals, an FA Cup and second place last season, isn’t he allowed a couple of mistakes?

The answer is probably yes, though with provisos. Liverpool should have been in a similar position to Arsenal this year, whose wage spending they almost match. Challenging for the title, and perhaps missing out right at the end, not 20 points off the pace with their chance gone by September.

They are not, because the manager got £40million of spending in the transfer market wrong. Manchester United can afford to do that, but Liverpool can not – they have to be perfect, because they are fourth in the wage table, not first.

So no more mistakes can be made in the transfer market, and Benitez has to get it right. His last three near £20million signings have been Aquliani, Johnson and Keane. He will get another £20million or so to spend in the summer, and if he continues that trend, then it will be a disaster.

You get my point now? Benitez isn’t solely to blame for Liverpool’s demise this season, not by a long shot, because the ownership issue casts a long and unnecessary shadow.

But he certainly must take some of the responsibility, and if he is to lead the club out of the current mess, then he has got to improve dramatically in the transfer market this summer.

From what i can see this Barclays bid its no different to a loan shark prowling a council estate offering another loan which is then used to pay of a original loan.You dont see much of the second loan ( in this case 20% ) but you are in effect paying interest on interest and thats not a good position to be in .How much will the interest be on this new loan ? and how will we be able to build a stadium without another loan and how much interest will we pay on that all in all it doesnt look good.
Digger what the point @181 because it seems pointless to me.
YNWA

Rafa we all love Aitchs work I’m sure. Just cutting off the inevitable at the pass is all mate. Sambo made some much appreciated and accurate observations on my behalf the other day and before we’re all at the O.K Corrall again I just figured…..whats the point ya know? As LB says its all the same old arguments and its all become terribly boring. We all know my thoughts on Lucas and we all know Aitch’s on Stevie. His opinion isnt gonna change mine and vice versa so….fuck it….ya know what I mean mate?

And another article… a feel good one because although it could be bullshit we bloody well need some cheering up!

WHY THINGS CAN ONLY GET BETTER FOR LIVERPOOL FANS FOLLOWING HICKS AND GILLETT’S DECISION TO SELL-UP

OK, so it’s as dry as an AA social club, but the financial news coming out of Anfield this week has massive implications for the future of Liverpool.

While I’m not yet suggesting there is cause for mass celebrations just yet, anyone with the best interests of this great club at heart can at least start to believe there is now a chance that the chaos and sheer embarrassment that has become a byword for Liverpool in the past three years may be ending.

Tom Hicks and George Gillett will announce formally this week that they will sell the whole of the club. Not part, as previously planned, not 50 per cent, not only one of the selling, but every share, from both owners. Barclays Capital have been appointed to conduct the search for new owners, just to confirm how serious they are.

They will also announce that they are standing down as joint chairmen, to be replaced by Martin Broughton, a serious and respected business leader who is chairman of British Airways and former President of the Confederation of British Industry.

There will be a further statement explaining that the make-up of the boardroom at Anfield will also change, effectively taking away the control of the Americans, and allowing the club’s executive officers, lead by Christian Purslow, to run the show without interference.

Finally, there is also likely to be an announcement that funds will be made available in the summer – potentially up to £50million – as Barclays Capital, one of the biggest and most respected investment banks in the world offer an interim refinancing package to stabilise the club in the period they need to find new owners.

I told you it was dry, and I know that many readers will already be finding their eyes glazing over. But let me put it more simply for you. From the end of this week, the Yanks are out.

It could take some months, perhaps even a year or more, to find new owners, but it will happen. And in the meantime, they will not be allowed to interfere in the running of the club, which will instead by directed by respected business professionals, who are at the very top of their field.

It would be natural for fans to be sceptical. I for one, won’t truly believe the Americans have gone until the new owner is sitting at a table in the Anfield trophy room, introducing him or herself.

But there IS real hope for optimism. Why? Because of the credibility of the people who will be unveiled this week to lead Liverpool towards a brighter future.

Martin Broughton, Barclays Capital and Christian Purslow would not risk their reputation trying to prop up a discredited, embarrassing regime. They would only agree to come into Anfield if they can control the situation, and influence the eventual endgame.

That is why Hicks and Gillett will stand down as chairmen immediately, and the structure of the boardroom will change, to remove the farcical situation of each warring owner effectively having the right to veto the other, hence nothing gets done. From now, they can be outvoted, giving control to the new chairman and his Managing Director.

Now, Purslow will steer the ship, backed by an effective financial team of Ian Ayre and Philip Nash who have already brought in massive new revenues to the club, with Broughton overseeing the whole affair.

After paying off existing loans, funds generated from the potential Barclays’ refinancing will be directed towards team rebuilding, aimed at stimulating success on the pitch to make the club more attractive to eventual buyers.

I know many of you believe it is too good be to be true, and will wonder why the Americans would hand over control of their club to someone else, but the answer is simple. They know it is the best option for them.

They have been trying to find a partner to come into Liverpool with them for the past 12 months, but their regime is so discredited no one is truly interested. Likewise, they can’t sell, because basically no one believes their valuation is accurate, because of the mess they have made at Anfield. They need to raise funds because of pressure from their current bankers, but can’t.

That has raised the real prospect of them losing money, if they have to sell a minority stake in the club quickly, and then clinging on to power at Anfield in an attempt to recoup their losses by holding out for exaggerated profits.

This way, the club is run properly by people with pristine reputations, and backed by a business in BarCap that has real credibility. It will allow Hicks and Gillett to eventually get out without having to conduct a fire sale, salvaging some of the profits they intended to make when they bought Liverpool (which obviously will anger many fans).

But importantly, it will allow Liverpool to progress, and be run properly without the interference that has proved so disastrous. Funding is already in place to begin the build of the new stadium, and with stability, that can finally happen, especially with a new owner on the horizon.

It won’t be a quick fix, because it will take time to nurse Liverpool’s reputation back to health, and to find the buyers who will take the club forward. But at this moment in time, it is by far the best option for the club after three years of mistrust and mistakes.

Purslow and his team have already illustrated that they can take Liverpool to their true level, because they have brought in sponsorship deals that have surpassed similar ones at Manchester United. Barcap and Broughton recognise that, and appreciate that the club is still, potentially, one of the biggest in the world, and without the Americans around, it can fulfill that potential.

So no dancing in the streets just yet, but at least if you are a Liverpool fan you can allow yourself the small hope that things will only get better from now on.

2 really good articles there LB, nice one. Some light at the end of the tunnel finally?

Digger, who knows? Different articles say slightly different things. The one above seems the most comprehensive but also seems a tad fanciful. I guess the next thing to look out for is the official appointment of the chairman and the official statement from Hicks and Gillett saying they will be selling ALL of their shares. Both is supposed to be happening this week.

LB – two very good articles – but as is alluded to by both your and the jouranlist’s piece, I’m not gonna start opening up the bottle of bubbly just yet

Some good points made in the first article about how much responsibility Rafa has to take for this mess of a season. I for one, am in pretty much complete agreement about the assessment given by David Maddock – be interesting to see what other think in here

Arthur
From what i presumed last summer we still had the Keane money and whatever money the owner might put in after Johnson and Aquilani were signed.
But as we know presumption is the mother of all f*ck-ups and this season has proved it.
YNWA

Well, LB, regarding the first article Maddock certainly gets some things right, and parts of his arguments seem to be valid. What he conveniently leaves out of the equation is the fact that Rafa, in all likelyhood, intended to sign more players last summer.

Perhaps it would have been better to keep Arbeloa in some ways and spend the Glenda money on a different position. On the other hand Johnson has made a very important offensive contribution this season, and defensively (as could be seen in Saturday’s El Clasico) Johnson is no worse than Arbeloa. Perhaps if Rafa had known at the time of signing Johnson he would have no money left to spend unless bringing it in by sales, his decision would have been different. Maddock is merely speculating on this point.

If we also consider what a bad season Gerrard’s had, how could it possibly be regarded as a mistake not to play him in the central midfield role? That is, a mistake to sign Aquilani instead of a second striker. After all, Gerrard had been immense as a second striker up until this season.

The conclusion is that although Maddock shows intelligence in his reasoning, which makes it an unusual and interesting newspaper article, it still contains several fallacies.

Regarding the second one it sounds promising, but I’m not getting my hopes up until I see some real evidence of financial improvement.

For me the Aquilani deal was the big gamble that Rafa took and in my view has failed. Sure he may be a good signing for next season (if he’s not a super-crock) but at what cost? Well it seems losing CL spot could be the price we pay.

Arthur, I agree with quite a bit of the first Article. What I think he needed to consider was the following:

Arbeloa had 1 year left on his contract and wanted to leave. Don’t we had much choice but to sell him.
Johnson was our best outfield player up until around October. He then got injured and has struggled to regain form since his return. Rafa couldn’t legislate for that.

With hindsight Rafa could have bought a striker instead of Aquilani and put Gerrard in midfield.

Under the circumstances Rafa was working under last season I think it would have been impossible to have been perfect in the transfer market. In May he is sending scouts to smooth over David Silva and talking about possibly breaking the transfer record then in July he found himself having to wheel and deal. Mistakes were probably inevitable.

Sachem, by the time Rafa sold Alonso and brought Aquilani in he knew we were skint. But I think Rafa looked at the situation and thought a midfield player was more priority over a striker. Maybe he figured Gerrard would have another great season and if Torres got injured we could function with Ngog, Kuyt and Voronin doing a job with Gerrard just behind. We can argue all day long about this and neither one of us would be 100% right or 100% wrong.

The big mistake for me was signing an injured player to replace our best performer from the previous season. I think Rafa knows this. He gambled and it back fired in the worse possible way.

Lets no count our chickens before they hatch, this will drag on just as long as the Americans have. I can’t believe a Chelsae season ticket holder is going to be our chairman. Another fuck up.

LB

Hindsight is indeed a wonderful thing.We all realise now another striker couldhave made the difference.Maddock should have done his homework on Arbeloa.The lad wanted to go home so Rafa hardly flogged him.
Then he says Rafa should have used the Alonso money to buy a striker.The Alonso money didn`t go on any players,it went to RBS.As far as i know only 5 million went to roma for Aquallini in the summer and the rest was to be payed in installments.
Correct me if i`m wrong here.Other than that i think Maddock makes fair enough points.

The second article is refreshing if your gullible.I`m sorry now but i think i can be forgiven for being a bit scepticle about it.How many false dawns have we had since we were all walked up the garden path by the cowboys.

They step down as co-chairmen.Someone else steps in “From the end of this week, the Yanks are out” me bollix.
As the article says i won`t believe it until the new owner is holding a press conference in that famous trophy room.

Just because they take a step back dosen`t mean shite unless the club is sold.Whatever they have it for sale for be it 500,600 or even 300 million i somehow find it hard to get excited about it.

The words, hook, line, and sinker… spring to mind.

There are so many factual holes in both those articles, (185 & 188) you could drive a fuckin tank through them!

We did not spend 40 million on Aqua and Jonson.
Aquilani’s eventual price will be 20 million, but his up-frint price was 9million.
Likewise, money owed us from Crouch deal, was used in part-exchange to acquire Johnson.
So in actual fact, we only spent close to 20 million and not the 40 million the article claims.
Also… Also, the article claims Rafa had 40 million to spend. This is NOT ture.
AND it claims Rafa had money from the Purslow deals … when in fact none of those deals were done in the summer (in terms of us having a check to cash)… and will bring in large ammounts over a period of time, as opposed to one lump sum that can be spent on players.

I know you all want to wake up tomorrow morning and have the clouds lifted and see sunny blue skies, as the sun bathes you in the news that the American oweners are gone.
But the Barclays deal does NOT mean the Yankas are out and Rafa has a 50 million warchest.
In fact… the Barclays deal means the Yanks get a stay of execution… instead of being forced to sell in July, they can now stick around for at least 6 months longer!

Read the fine print for fucks sake!
That deal effectively takes the 237 million owed to RBS and refinances it to the tune of 300 million!
INCREASING our debt.
Now maybe that gives Rafa 50 million… but maybe not… coz it also states that “Funding is already in place to begin the build of the new stadium” …. really? Where the fuck did that come from?
As I recall, Purslow told SOS, not 2 months ago, (in both their version and his official minutes) that there were no such funds!

Broughton may be the man at the helm, but it is still the Yanks who own us. He will be operating on their behalf… not Barclays!

This move is designed to get RBS’s fingers out of the pie… and give LFC fans a “feel good” factor that the Yanks are out.

They are NOT… they are just smirking in the background, instead of on the front pages, smug in the fact that we may have locked them out of the stadium… but they still hold the reigns… they still haven’t put a fuckin dime of their own money into the club… and a refinanced mid-table Prem club will still make them lots and lots of money!

timmy,
“I won`t believe it until the new owner is holding a press conference in that famous trophy room.”

…err… I won’t believe it until someone trusted has walked behind that “new owner” verifying for us that there are no strings attached, or being pulled, and that there is no one behind the curtain!

… and even then….

Most transfer deals are done in installments its rare that upfront payments in full are made so the Aquilani £17m deal isn’t one of a kind. I doubt he was the only £17m player ever bought with a £5m or £9m down payment.

Regarding Johnson – yes Portsmouth owed us money but an £18m signing is an £18m signing. Just to illustrate the point. If we didn’t buy Johnson, Pompey would still have owed us money. We could have put £9m as a down payment for someone else and use the money owed to us by Pompey to add to it. No?

As for the money brought in from Purslow and Ian Nash – they helped to secure contracts of Gerrard, Torres etc. We didn’t get a lump some of cash but neither did we pay those players 4 year contracts up front. The club secured revenue streams and thus players get their wages paid on a monthly basis over 4-5 years.

The part of that article that I mostly disagree with is:

“But when he signed a new contract last year, he knew exactly what he was getting himself into, and the conditions he would be operating under”.

Well that was sort of my point LB.
Its like people banging on about how we should “get Raul on a free” …ignoring he’d demand £120k per week.

There’s a lot more to this stuff. (as evidenced by the Portsmouth conundrum where they have 6 odd games left and loads of players who will trigger appearance bonus clauses written into their contracts if they are played in any of those games! … and they haven’t been able to pay them as it is… with David James even foregoing part of his salary to cover the groundskeepers salaries!)

We know Aquilani’s deal involves payments for appearances… but how many of our other players have the same clauses… (a lot I’d bet) and that’s all outgoing monies…
…AND I read somewhere today, that the interest on our £237 million loan, is £1million quid… every NINE DAYS!!!

It has been suggested many times that Rafa was promised £20 million… Rafa did not get that.
The article states that he was given £40 million… clearly not the case… and it didn’t suggest we should have bought someone else other than Johnson… just that we spent £40 million on those two players… which wasn’t the case… even going so far (as you pointed out LB) to say that we should have kept Arbeloa… as though that was an option, coz the lad wanted to go back to Spain… period!

If Rafa had had 40 million in the summer, then surely, subtracting the 20 million actually spent on the above named players, we’d have had enough to secure the services of David Silva… a player we were supposedly in serious talks with?

Whereas we could barely manage to come up with £1.5 million (plus one of our youngsters) to secure Kyrgiakos for last minute defensive cover, when Sami decided he needed to keep playing. (…just one more thing that couldn’t have been anticipated in July… its a safe bet that had Sami stayed, he’d have played more games than Kyrgiakos has!)

And yes the Purslow money did secure contracts negotiated throughout this season… business that was vitally important for both our immediate AND long-term future.
…but that is NOT the argument the article makes. It insinuates that Rafa mispent (those funds brought in by Purslow) on Johnson and Aquilani.

As for knowing what he was getting into. He was made promises. Surprisingly enough, in Carra’s biography, JC states (without going into detail) that Rafa was promised all sorts of stuff when he first signed (the implication being significant transfer funds) only to arrive in Liverpool and discover none of it was gonna happen.

… though I guess that kinda makes his point dunnit really? Rafa probably shouldn’t be trusting them (G&H) when there’s a seat at Juve, or Real on offer?

LB,I know most transfers bar the ladyboy one are dealt in installments these days.But the media seem to portrait that rafa got 30 million from Real for Alonso and handed the lot to roma.We constantly here “he got rid of alonso and spent the money on Aquilini”.In fact he will end up spending twenty million euros on him around 17 million pounds.So thats just over half the fee.

Rafa was probably lead to believe he`d have the change to spend on a back up striker.Even 12 million or so would have bought decent back up.

As for Johnson i think we don`t know if Rafa would have got the money owed to us by pompey if he hadn`t bought Glen.My guess with the cowboys track record for pulling on promises,is no.

Next week we`ve the semi against Athletico.We`re 180 minutes away from another european final.How could some people not care weather we do well or not?
Football is all about picking up trophies and going to big finals.I can`t believe the ignorance in some quarters to the europa league.Ok it ain`t the CL but there`s a final and a possibility of a trophy to show for this dissappointing season.

Urgh… I feel nausious!
I just thrust my hand in the air and yelled “YES” at the final whistle for Chavs-Bolton.

I feel so dirty!

And timmy…
If we hadn’t done the Johnson deal in the summer… who’s to say we’d have got anything out of Portsmouth?
That money would have been written off… along with the bulk of the people they owe money to, who got nought but a tip of the hat!

As for the UEFA… its assinine to suggest we don’t want it. Its a fuckin trophy for fucks sake. Winning them is the business we’re in and we’re two games from the final.

…though if we don’t get 4th, I’d just as soon see us finish 7th and not have any Euro footy next season…
…possibly mounting a solid Prem challenge next year… without the constant midweek distractions/exertions of Euro footy.

Strange feeling alright Aitch willing the chavs to win.Lesser of two evils and all that!

Just think about what way you`ll feel when city play the scum sunday,or when the scum play spurs or when villa go to city or when the chavs play spurs etc etc so many dirty feelings to come!

Something else entirely overlooked in the buying of Johnson…all CL teams need a certain number of Club Trained and Association Trained players in the CL Squads…Johnson qualifies as Association Trained, Arbeloa does not.

http://www.uefa.com/newsfiles/19071.pdf

Page 76

Good one from Carra here

http://www.liverpoolfc.tv/news/latest-news/carra-we-ll-still-attract-stars

Atich you go boy always good to read your thoughts. Sitting in a Hotel Room in Nigeria and finally able to get onto the net to catch up. Great Blog Gerry and a very disappointing result, I actually got to watch the match, delayed but it did not matter. I think 4th is a very slim possibility right now but City can still blow it I hope, but it is looking bleak.

As for those two articles none are strictly speaking anywhere near the actual truth. This is pure journo speak putting 2 and 2 together to get 6 or making conclusion to under pin their opinions and hopes in some cases.

Firstly I am bitterly disappointed that they have even considered an extension as it just gives the Cunts more time to try and make a profit. No extension would mean that they are forced to accept a deal at the last minute, which is exactly what it is going to boil down to after the 6 month extension. Most of the serious players will wait until their backs are against the proverbial wall before entering the fray. Its business after all and you wait for the right moment to strike. The more desperate they become the better the price. All this does is give them more time to squeeze more profit out of the tranaction to the detriment of the club, fucking up our entire summer transfer business with the uncertainty of everything.

The only good thing is if we do, which is looking highly likely, finish outside the CL spot we loose about 40 mill quid worth of revenue, however if we have a decent run in the Europa Cup we could claw back 20 mill or more. It does devalue the club marginally but more from a high profile and mind set perspective in the short term and adds more pressure on the Twats to sell.

For all the people who are poo pooing the Europa Cup, would you prefer the Carling Cup instead? Outside Chelsea, whom I hope wins the Prem if not Arsenal, what have the rest of the top 8 prem team got to look forward to?

The transfer article is sheer crap. Hindsight is a wonderful thing. You plan according to a budget you are told to work within. Arbie’s sales was the result of an agreement done last year that if he stayed another year he would be allowed to go back to Spain. The Alonso saga has been done to death and he wanted to go to Real and we did a great bit of business in getting the money we got for him. Aquilani was a gamble but on the advice of our medical staff that said he would be full match fit within 2 months. Yes that did not work out. His problems would not have been noticeable if Gerrard and Torres and the other 9 first team injured players did not hit us as badly as it did.

The Johnson purchase was pure business and a good one at that. We would have lost the Crouch money with P’Smiths going into administration and the writing has been on the wall for a long time. We solve two problems at once, get our money back and get a top class attacking full back. So far we have spent less than 15 odd mill of the 50 odd mill Rafa bought in, in the Summer. Only to be told he had no more money to spend. Out the window goes the second striker, out the window goes the wide attacking player, out the widow goes the defensive back up. They try to quickly off load Babel to Turkey to bring in Turan it does not work, among other sales they tried to do. Have to bring back Vorinon ect, ect.

All this, along with our injury list and Rafa got it wrong in the transfer market? Lets play fair he was fucked from the start by our two twats that actually don’t own us, the banks, us but are fucking us up by the second because they are greedy cunts and will do everything to hang on to increase their profit.

I wanted the deadline to come and go and for them to walk away with sweet fuck all when some business man offered the bank the exact money to cover all debts.

Keith, why do you think the banks keep giving extensions to the deadline? And what do you make of the restructuring of the board? Of course this is all speculation as none of it has been confirmed yet. The club has made absolutely no comment as of yet.

Another thing. I see that Spirit of Shankly are pissed off that they are now being ignored by Purslow. Well it’s no wonder they are being ignored as the last time they met with him they revealed several sensitive points of discussion that were said off the record. Keith, I think at the time you said SOS fucked up there and that Purslow wouldn’t be getting into any dialogue with them again. Looks like you were right.

You make some valid points Keith about the transfer article but I think it’s a bit naive to say that Rafa was somehow duped into thinking Aquilani would be fit in 2 months time. I remember many posters on this forum were EXTREMELY sceptical that we’d see Aquilani anytime before Christmas and you know, despite my lack of medical knowledge, this was essentially proven to be the case.

The fact that Rafa has since barely used Aquilani since he’s regained his fitness, further highlights the folly of this particular transfer. I mean can anyone honestly answer why he’s not playing Aqua in a lot more games? Has Rafa seen something in him that makes him believe he can’t cut it in the Premier League? It’s looks very much like the Robbie Keane nonsense all over again

Arthur

I think its only fair we let Aquilini have a full pre season under his belt before we make full judgement on weather he can “cut it in the Premier League”.

One thing a lot of the staunch Rafa supporters are unwilling to concede is that it was maybe a mistake to spend a potential £17m on an injured player that had played an average of 16 games per season over the previous 3 years.

Looking at this season it’s a mistake. If next season he plays 50 games, scores 15 goals and has 10 assists then that is a different story.

No Timmy – I’m not saying he can’t cut it – but I’m wondering is Rafa thinking that? Why else has he refused to play him on so many occasions?

And secondly Tim – should we really have signed a player back in Sep 09 that we can only start judging in Sep 10??? That’s madness.

I know the Aquilani deal was not a straight £20 Million deal (in installments) but as LB mentioned – these type of deals are done all the time. So I don’t think the argument that “Rafa didn’t have 20 million in reality” holds much water.

Put it simply:

Rafa loses Alonso – partly through his actions in the pre-season in 2008/09 and partly because the player himself wants to leave.

He searches high and low and the only midfielder he deems suitable is Aquilani (for the budget he has). He is then told Aquilani is currently injured and might not play for 2/3 months AT LEAST!.

Rafa should have walked away – knowing that he could play Gerrard in various roles to accommdate Alonso’s departure and looked other positions – mainly a £20 million rated striker and attempt to construct a similar payment plan that he has since used for Aqua.

I can’t think of any manager in the PL that would such a gamble*. A gamble that I think he had very little chance of winning. (* The gamble being – we’d still be in contention for the league come December 09 by the time Aquilani would in theory be fully fit)

We all knew Torres and Gerrard are liable to get injured so I’m sure Rafa did too. The Aquilani transfer was far too risky and it’s blown up in our faces

Blown up in the face like one of Wyle E Coyote’s elaborate plans.

If Rafa did have 20 mill to pay for Aquilani wouldnt he have spent it ? Would he have gone begging for the Kyriagcos money? Do you think the rest of the money is sat in Rafa’s draw in his office and he forgot all about it ? No its more likely he didn’t have the money wether you think it holds water or not.
You say we didn’t expect him fit untill christmas but if memory serves it was “matchfit ” and thats a different thing altogether as to when will his injury be healed.
As to why he hasn’t played more games, as we discussed before it may be to do with the payment it triggers for so many appearances which will probably happen in sept after our business in the summer, which says a lot about our finances
Or maybe he’s just not showing enough in training to warrant a regular start or maybe he is but other midfielders are also deserving a start.
I suppose it depends on your own train of thought if its on the one track to the Rafa’s fault platform then thats where a one track mind will take you .
YNWA

LB
Bought from the ACME footballer company :-]

Anyway apparently 100,000 Real Madrid fans were polled as to who should be their next manager 40,000 say Rafa no other manager came close.
YNWA

Arthur i think its only fair that we do judge him after the pre season.Weather Rafa made the right decision in buying him in the first place is neither here nor there.

I`m only saying the lad has been playing catch up in his time here.This season he has offered little but next season with a full pre season under his belt abd he`s on par fitness wise with the rest,he could be a gem for us.

Then again he could be a dud,lets just reserve judgement until then is all i`m suggesting.

If Rafa goes to Real I think it’ll be a mistake for him. If he lasted more than a season I’d be amazed. His vision of how the game should be played does not correlate with that of the Madrid fans. Cappello won the league for them and still was sacked. Tight, controlling, risk averse, cautious managers dont last at Madrid. Winning is not enough. It must be done in style at Madrid. If I was Rafa and I was leaving I’d be heading for Turin, the Cattenacio Mecca. Just my thoughts, probably wrong no doubt!

I’m amazed the Real fans would want Rafa – not because he’s a bad manager but just as Digger says he doesn’t play the kind of football they crave. They might win something if they got him though

wouldn’t be too sure Alonso would be a happy camper if Rafa went to Real

Real fans and their board are short sighted. They hired Capello and Schuster and both were sacked due to perceived negative football. Even though they won the title. Despite this they want Rafa and their 2nd choice is Mourinho. Again 2 managers who like to control matches and start with a solid defensive base. They’d end up sacking both.

They sacked Hiddink after 4 months and they fired Del Bosque who won 2 CLs and 2 league titles. Apparently he wasn’t high profile enough for their image. They have had 8 managers since.

Real have had (I think) 24 managers since 1986

MENTAL

How could a team with players like Ronaldo,kaka,alonso and whoever they`ll bring in in the summer play negative football.

I know they`d have to play to Rafa`s way but he isn`t the ultra defensive coach he`s made out to be.

I was at anfield in 2002 when Rafa`s valencia gave Liverpool a footballing lesson.It was probably the most impressive team performance i have whitnessed live.

If Rafa gets proper backing and has the right players he wants,his teams can play good footy.

Also i think Real fans wish for Rafa because they believe he can deliver the European cup for them.

Timmy, it’s not merely about trophies for Real. Del Bosque won the CL and got fired. They want champaign fantasy football. Think Brazil 1970, Barcelona now, Arsenal at times, Liverpool 1988…. If they don’t get that the coach gets fired. Hence 24 coaches since 1986.

I don’t think there is any doubt Rafa will one day be the manager of Real Madrid. If he makes the move there in a couple of months or in 20 years I don’t know. But both Rafa, his family and the folks at Real Madrid knows he will manage them one day.

The trouble with the demands at Real Madrid is that no manager in the world could possibly live up to them. They seem to think that all it takes is to bring in a number of world class players and a world class manager, then the club will automatically win the league title, the Champions League and play sublime football.

The Real Madrid supporters in some ways have the same problem as some of our supporters, who expect us to play football like we did in the glory years of King Kenny in the 1980s, bringing in titles like there’s nothing to it. They go to Anfield or sit in front of the telly and demand entertainment. The Real Madrid supporters expect nothing less than the kind of football they played back in the 1950s and early 60s with Alfredo di Stéfano and that lot.

The problem is that it takes time and patience to reach those kinds of levels. The whole club need to have a long-term plan and playing philosophy, like Barcelona, Arsenal, AC Milan and (it has to be admitted) Man Utd. Juventus also used to have that (though with unconfirmed amounts of cheating involved) but seem to have lost their way at the moment. From what I’ve gathered listening to interviews with Rafa and two of his signings last summer (not Johnson and Aquilani, but Segura and Borrell) this is exactly what Rafa is trying to create at Liverpool. The youth department is vital to make the long-term plan work, and not least of all to have teams at all levels within the club play the same kind of football, to make it easier for youngsters to break into the first team.

This is one of the reasons I would consider it a great setback if Rafa were to leave the club, because he is yet to put his long-term plan into fruition. Liverpool doesn’t work like Barcelona, where the club is run a certain way thanks to people higher up the hierarchy than the manager, which allows them to bring in new managers who fit their way of doing things, like managers who bring in players that fits into their tactical system. At Liverpool, Rafa has the same kind of influence as Ferguson and Wenger at their respective clubs. If he was sacked or chose to leave, we’d have to build more or less from scratch. It’s mind boggling that before Rafa, we were in no man’s land in terms of long-term plans. The kind of incompetence allowed at a club like Liverpool back then is unbelievable.

I don’t know about Juventus right now. They seem to have the money, but not a clear long-term plan like in the old days. Besides, Rafa wouldn’t be allowed the same kind of influence there that he currently has at Liverpool. In Italy, the manager pick the team and that’s more or less it. The club President and the director of football are the ones in charge. I honestly don’t see why Rafa would be tempted by such a supposition. He could well end up at Real Madrid however, despite the crazy demands. It is after all the club he has supported since he was a kid.

Personally, I think one bad season isn’t nearly enough to give up on Rafa and what he is trying to accomplish at Liverpool. It annoys me to this day that so many began calling for his head as early as October or November last year, after our best season in the league for 20 odd years.

LB
I remember some fans were calling for his head in 2006 and yes Real Madrid fans do remind me of some of our fans and Newcastle fans come to think of it.
Every thing on a plate and they want it yesterday or spoilt brats in other words.
And honestly i dont think Alonso would be upset he went to Real knowing full well Rafa may follow.
Anyway ive got a bit of a dilemma my lad wants this new kit in May and their giving a free towel & sports bag with every shirt. what to do ? i cant bear the thought of giving G&H any money.
YNWA

LB it was me that had an argument with FS on that very point and I said then it was a mistake I am gob smacked that they are upset that he won’t talk to them; surly they cannot be that thick.

As to the perceived mistake LB it is not if he had the money he was promised because he could have brought in a good quality back-up striker and dropped Gerrard back into the midfield if Aquilani did not recover quick enough. We also had Aurellio to slot into the midfield, Benny and Kuyt to play the second striker role.

In hindsight it looks like a major gamble but if your budget is whipped out from under your arse halfway through the transfer window you are fucked. Hence the scramble for defensive cover and having to pawn Nemeth who might have had an opportunity as the second striker to get the Hercules.

More dodgy math from sportspromedia.com

hmmmm?

Now most will probabaly wanna argue about the last 13 words of that quote….
…but me…. I’m wondering just what fuckin magical mystical world the 50 million quid is gonna come from?

G&H’s back pocket? …. er… I think not!!!

LB, I know the question was directed at Keith, but here ya go…

Simply put… banks make money on debt… not capital assets.
They are reportedly making £1 million quid in interest (on the £237m loan) …EVERY 9 DAYS!
£1,000,000 every fuckin 9 days????
WiseGuys from Jersey call that “the vig”!

Now granted, that figure may be far from acurate… but let’s say its half that…. 1/2 mill every 9 days…
“Extention you say? Sure thing, sign right here.” Cha-ching!

Again… fairly simple from where I’m sitting.
“Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain.”
(or in this case… men)

LFC fans will be happy as pigs in shite, coz “G&H aren’t running the club anymore.”
But Broughton won’t be following RBS’s instructions.
He won’t be following Barcalys’ instructions.
He certainly won’t be following Purslow’s directives.
He’ll be getting his orders from G&H.

And we’ll buy the new kit, pay more for tickets, continue our sky subscriptions… while they count our money in the fuckin Caymans.

….because what far too many LFC fans seem to be unable to grasp (or maybe they just wanna ignore it coz it requires thought) is that while winning might make an owner more money… it also costs a lot more money to achieve…
…whereas…
… mid-table mediocrity costs less, but still MAKES YOU MONEY!

arrgh… the 2nd part of that above post … from “Again… fairly simple…” on was in response to the 2nd question you posed…

Look at Newcastle.
They went down… and still filled the fuckin stadium every week.
Do you think that fat wanker made money, or lost it?

Aitch most of the money comes from TV and sponsorship these days so Newcastle would have lost out on a lot of dough. Having said that they did get the parachute payment. Ashley lost a lot of money though. Unlike G&H he bought the club and took on its debt with his own money.

Regarding Aquaman
Whenever i see a new player play for us i always judge them 1st on the things you can’t sort on the training ground ie technical ability and intelligence.

When i first saw Aquilani he passed the test on technical ability and he seems to want the ball all the time(Believe it or not some midfield player treat the ball like a hot potato).

Yes you do get the odd stray pass and occasional loss of posession.And also he may find himself out of position sometimes.

But I think the fact he seems to be player who’s willing to step up and take responsibility as a playmaker and is confident on the ball shows a football intelligence.

The tactical side of things we can hammer into him at the training ground.But we have the building blocks for a very good Liverpool player.

He does lack intensity in his play at the moment but that comes from him being used to playing in a much slower league in serie a.Where the teams tend to jab at there opponents and wait for a chance to throw a big punch(to use boxing speak)

Whereas here in the English premier league,most teams go toe to toe from start to finish.

So you can’t carry passengers in central midfield who are not defensively/tactically aware.

I think this the main reason Rafa has left him out and preferred Lucas

When Aquilani gets used to the premier league and what is expected of him defensively like Alonso did I think he will be a fantastic player for Liverpool.
IMHO
YNWA

well if 4th is out of reach so too must be 5th cant see villa catch us but who can tell? so its 6th or 7th in the league and a possible final appearance. pompey got relegated and made a final appearance villa will finish just the same as us with a final appearance. acceptable? it would seem so.

this will be a monumental summer with regards the future of this club i cant see city letting go of 4th(providing they get through the play-offs) with the money they have for many many years its just a matter of time before they win the thing really with endless pots of cash.

but what the hell if its another twenty years so be it. get rid of the owners at all costs try and build the new ground and at least try and compete for the 4th place every season. what a difference a year makes eh.

Arthur @213. You say rafa could have got a striker and used stevie in midfield.

1) Stevie has been crook all season, so i bet you would have complained that rafa didn’t buy a midfielder

2) rafa gambled on aqua, we will know soon if it was worth it, cause remember he is for long term. Plus a fit worlds class midfielder is not 17mil but 25mil+.

3) were there adequate world class strikers available last year (who would sit on the bench)?

4) did rafa have other targets, but the structure of this exact payment process suit rafas plans (maybe a lower initial payment than usual so he can use extra money elsewhere)

Im merely trying to point out the variables that are always different. I’d Imagine every transfer and contracts are all different. Football isn’t black and white, which is how you are stating some arguments.

Guys,

(1) On the Aquaman transfer:

After losing a very good player in Alonso, we had to get new players in. We already had Masch, Gerrard and Lucas in midfield, which is pretty good on paper. So taking a gamble on Aquaman at 17m while giving him a season to recover and blend into the team seems reasonable to me.

Can anyone here have known at the beginning of the season that Gerrard will have one of his most under-performing season? That, to me, is one of the main reasons for our bad season so far.

And what about Mascherano’s bad form until after Argentina qualified for world cup?

Yes, 17m is a lot of money, but do you think we have the money to buy 40m rated David Villa or 30m rated David Silva when we even suffer to cough up an additional 2m to get Hercules?
Please re-read what rome77 has said in #215.

On hindsight, we can say the gamble did not go well given the results this season. But to say that without even considering the injury crisis and loss of form of Stevie G is plain prejudice against Rafa.

Like what timmytorres has said, we’d be in a better position to judge this signing next season.

(2) On Johnson’s transfer:

We need a backup to Arbeloa and so Rafa got Johnson in, albeit at a high price.

Please tell me, in this day and age, whether you can find a young England first choice player for a cheap price. I’ll start bidding for him on EBay.

As Aitch has said in #199, the money Pompey owed us in the Crouch transfer was used to offset the fee, money that most likely would have been written off if we had not sealed the transfer.

(3) Injury to Torres

Another reason for our bad season is the long absence of Torres. Just look at Rooney being unavailable during this period and the effects it has had on the Mancs. So it baffles me that people are not sympathetic to the team for losing a better striker in Torres for at least half a season!

I understand that LB.
Strictly speaking Ashley/Newcy isn’t the best financial example, of course.

The point I was making is this…
Ashley may have lost money from not being in the Prem… But as you say he got the parachute payment… and he got money from the Championship TV deal.
Yes of course, its less money, but its still income.
They have had near-sell-out crowds all season, in a big stadium, and now, are right back up.

(not knowing their finances, and just going off vague recollections of summer/early season articles)…

… Newcy restructured player wages, and got shut of a few of the big earners…
…plus without the pressure of competing in the Prem… where their current manager would have been deemed “not glamorous enough”… they were able to effect a consistency on and off the field and some real team spirit.

So having lost money last season, did Ashley make money this season?
Granted probably not as much as he would have made in the Prem… but he certainly did… especially with the auto-promotion spot.

What does that have to do with LFC?

Well, people often ask questions of the Yanks… or more to the point, suggest they are batshit at business…

… but there are “American Sports Franchises” that have existed for decades, never won a fuckin thing, or been perennial “also-rans” and yet made their owners gazillions!…

So too in the UK… but the difference is the “culture of success” for want of a better phrase, where-by WE as fans “believe” that 1st is 1st and 2nd is nowhere… and therefore make higher demands on our players, managers, owners, than exists in American Sports.

LFC fans question the Yank’s business practises, because they don’t appear to have a grasp on how to win the Prem… (or anything else to do with footy actually )
…but LFC has still made them lots and lots of money without that Prem title we as fans so covet…
… and THAT is what they care about… not giving us the elusive #19.

Dropping out of the CL, and Languishing in 7th, may seem like failure to us the fans…
…but…
The Yanks paid Zero Down… have pocketed money every season… and will walk with cash!
They’ll consider that a successful business venture!

Stevie-smeavy

I personally think that using 13 players in 19 different defensive line-up configurations is the reason we didn’t get better results this season… but hey, that’s just excuses!

as for Aqua… how about this?

2 seasons ago Rafa inquired about David Silva. The price was 19 million. We didn’t have the funds. Now he’s 30 million?

So yeah… I reckon given we had a fit, solid looking squad, with few injuries, in July…
…5 million up front, rising to 9 million, eventually rising to 19 million, was probably pretty good business… given the few glimpses we’ve had of him when he was actually playing with 10 other fit lads around him.

Of course we won’t know until we’ve actually seen the lad fit and playing with 10 other fit lads for more than 1 or 2 games.

But of course that’ll never happen, coz Rafa is stubborn and doesn’t actually want to succceed…
…and so deliberately benches players he knows can win a game for him, in favor of playing in-form players actually doing their job well…
…and won’t be told by Ted the Brickie from Bootle, that those players are crap and not good enough for LFC…
…and they should be sold so we can bring in David Silva in exchange for Phillip Degen and a signed pair of Kenny Dalglish’s underpants!

Correct me if I am wrong Atich but I think a signed pair of Kennys underpants would have more impact that Vorinon.

I love all this hindsight pronouncements. Lets face it we have had a shit season by all accounts when everything went tits up. We lost Torres and Gerrard for half the campaign and Gerrard is still no where near the foirm we all come to expect from him the same goes for Torres who is injured yet again. You throw in all the other injuries, beach ball and penalty incidents and who’s to blame? Rafa and his transfer dealings on a zero budget.

The same old crap comes up time and again, he is negative, he plays boring football yet we where top scorers last year. Anybody with a half fit squad with three quarters of your creative talent crocked will suffer a loss of form but most of you are missing the basic point that Atich has pointed out it has been our defensive lapses that see us in the position we are in. How many times have we conceded in the last few minutes to loose or draw games?

We have to accept it has just been one of those years where we got shafted for various reason and move on. If all that happens is them Yanks are bought out it will have been a success in my book.

So Keith, Akka and Aitch – Rafa is not cupable at all in this mess of a season? I’m seeing a lot of reasons (well made points all) for our disasterous campaign, but nowhere do I see you mention the fact that our manager needs to face up to some responsibility in all this. Not all – but definitely some

Ahhh Lads.
Hindsight is a wonderful thing eh.

I remember at the start of the season polls on all the sites asking us to predict where we would finish. Based on the feeling of optimism from last season, 1st and Number 19 came in the high 90%s.

Note those people didn’t say at the time we’ve got a crap manager who’s too stubborn and shit in the transfer market so we can’t win it. They had hope and faith in what Liverpool FC, Rafa Benitez and the players might achieve.

Now roll on the season and mistakes have been made. By referees, by players, by fans throwing beachballs, by medical staff by the owners/borrowers and YES by Rafa Benitez.

Some on here keep a level head and opt for analysis. Some blindly follow Rafa (perhaps that’s stretching it a bit) and some blindly criticise him.

I’ll put my pop-psychology hat on. You can tell who has resilience and coping strategies for dealing with disappointment. You can also tell the infantile regressives who didn;t get breast-fed and throw their dummy out the pram whenever adversity strikes.

For that reason, You’ll Never Walk Alone is more than just a good song from a musical, it is a clarion call to BELIEVE despite all adversity. It is a call to stick together come what may. It is a call to grow up and man-up.

Here’s to the rest of the season. Here’s to winning the cup. Here’s to getting rid of the Borrowers by June.

YNWA

Well said McrRed

Arthur, Rafa has come out publicly & stated that he HAS made wrong decisions this season – unlike (eg) Mr.Ferguson. No manager is perfect & I think Rafa has therefore taken some responsibility with this admission. However, and maybe I’m being a one-eyed Reds supporter here, I can’t think (off the top of my head) of any other side that has had (a) our ‘luck’ this season, (b) injuries to key players, (c) disputed ref decisions and (d) H&G and lack of a decent war kitty. Obviously I’m speaking about the top 8 or so teams here. I know Everton have had bad injuries & no money, and the Arse have had injuries, but add the above points to the fact that NO other team has had the fucking diabolical press & anti-rafa campaign (is it because he is foreign?) from the media, and you have working conditions and chances of success that a Banana Republic in Africa might experience.
I know, same old excuses raised, but I do think that they are relevant. Why would 2 of the bigegst clubs in the world want Rafa? Let’s just consider this season an abomination & hope that some of the youth together with Aqua (he will be a fantastic player for us – I’m sure about that – and as FS says, I see a bit of Terry Mac in him) & maybe/maybe a couple of decent signings in the off-season, we will see Rafa’s toil & visions take effect next season.
One can only hope, and I for one hope that Rafa will be at the helm next season. At least we won’t have a scum bag fuck-head running our club.

Hope I didn’t have too much of a rant here – and I know it’s probably too much to ask for a couple of ‘decent signings next season – but I’ve had a shite day & need to get this little story off my chest.
My brother & I watched the Manc/Reds game at a pub here in Johannesburg. During the game, some fat cow shouted ‘Scouse scum’ after Stevie G fouled a dirty Manc. After the game I approached her & the fat bloke next to her & told her that she was ‘totally out of order’. She then says ‘it wasn’t me, the girl behind me said it’. Yeah right, not another woman within 20 feet! Anyway’s, today I pull out into the traffic on the way to work & cut another vehcile off in the process, and who should flash her lights at me – the same ugly cow! I gave her the finger but spent the rest of the journey (& subsequent 3 hours) with my blood boiling.
Just had to get this off my chest guys…just shows you we even have to deal with this shit over here.
Feel better now…

Hey Rafa, want to take advantage of my mates-rates pop-psychology-therapy sessions?

Just hop up on the couch…

Now this woman, who does she resemble in your life?

JUSTICE FOR THE 96

YNWA

Yeah Mac, I need some therapy after this season. And now I see that we are being linked with a Chinese businessman? It never ends.
And lest we forget: Justice For The 96!!! We will never forget you.

15/4/1989 15:06 – YNWA

Boys, it’s been a while since I’ve posted in here, but I bumped into something I found on another thread that sums up how I feel perfectly. I apologize up front for the language and mis-spellings:

http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=256476.0

I’ve already heard loads of bad teds (even matchgoing, loyal red, bad teds) saying that they don’t rate the UEFA cup, that its mickey mouse etc etc. Yet if you’d said to the same people at the end of 2004 (pre Rafa) that they could go to a European final (having only been to one other in the previous 19 years) they’d be creaming themselves.

Forza Rafa, Forza LFC.

To further the post, Rafa’s in his 5th European semifinal in the past 7 years (if you include Valencia), and if we’re lucky enough to get past Athleti, it would be his 4th European final in those 7 years.

Yes the man has his weaknesses and he makes mistakes, but if he’s such a piss poor manager, why is his name constantly getting linked with some of the biggest clubs in Europe?

Justice for the 96, YNWA.

Rafa hits the big 50 today.

Happy birthday Señor Benitez Maudes.

lvcjmac: Love your work!

Finally one of the ownership rumours coming true.

http://www.liverpoolfc.tv/news/latest-news/lfc-announces-new-chairman

Signs of things to come?

Tom Hicks and George Gillett today officially put Liverpool Football Club up for sale.

The Americans confirmed in a 9am statement that they are to relinquish their ownership of the Reds as they appointed new Chairman Martin Broughton to oversee the sale of Britain’s most successful ever football club to new owners.

Barclays Capital have been hired to lead the bid to find new owners.

British Airway Chairman Broughton will work alongside current Managing Director Christian Purslow and other existing Anfield board members to lead the Reds into a new era – which it is intended will still include the buiilding of a long since planned new stadium – after all the troubles of the past three years.

A press release issued this morning read: “Liverpool Football Club today announced that Martin Broughton has been appointed as Chairman with immediate effect.

“The new Chairman will oversee a formal sale process launched by current owners, Thomas Hicks and George Gillett Jr.

“Following numerous expressions of interest from third parties, the Club has engaged Barclays Capital to advise on the sale process.

“The Club has the full support of its existing bankers for this process and has financing in place which will fully support the Club’s operations.”

London-born Broughton, 62, as well as being Chairman of British Airways, is deputy president of the Confederation of British Industry.

The statement continuned: “Mr Broughton will work alongside the club’s existing management team of Managing Director Christian Purslow, Commercial Director Ian Ayre and Financial Director Philip Nash.

“The day-to-day running of the club remains in the hands of this team, who have overseen a significant improvement in the financial performance of the Club since 2007.

During that time the Club’s revenues have increased by 55%; Commercial revenues have increased by 83%; Operating profit (before player trading and exceptionals) has increased by 60%.

“The Club will continue to progress the well-advanced plans for a new, larger, and state-of-the–art stadium which will form an exciting part of the club’s future development.”

Dallas based Hicks and Colorado based Gillett said: “Owning Liverpool Football Club over these past three years has been a rewarding and exciting experience for us and our families.

“Having grown the Club this far we have now decided together to look to sell the Club to owners committed to take the Club through its next level of growth and development.

“We are delighted that Martin Broughton has agreed to take the position of Chairman, working alongside the club’s excellent senior management team. Martin is a distinguished business leader of excellent judgment and with a great reputation.

“He is a genuine football supporter and will seek to oversee the sales process in the best interests of the Club and its supporters.”

Martin Broughton said:“I am excited and honoured to be taking up this position.
“Liverpool is a great club with a fantastic history.

“I will run this sale process in the right way, for the benefit of the club and its fans.

“Liverpool is one of the world’s greatest clubs and my aim is to try and ensure that we find new owners who are able to build on the club’s recent improved financial performance in order to help deliver sporting success.”

“Owning Liverpool Football Club over these past three years has been a rewarding and exciting experience for us and our families,” said Tom Hicks and George Gillett via a statement on the club’s website. “Having grown the club this far we have now decided together to look to sell the club to owners committed to take the club through its next level of growth and development.”

What a bunch of cynical, unreptentent fucks.

But this HAS to be good news? No? I mean we may not see the benefit for a few months or so but hopefully our next owners will have the cash and the cop-on to take us forward

Happy Birthday Rafa.

Take a look at this lads!

He really has bled for the cause! I am truly Shocked.

ttp://www.empireofthekop.com/anfield/?p=13551

RIP to the 96 YNWA

Well, let’s wait & see what happens – glad it’s official. I would like to think that the protesting fans & SoS had something to do with the Wanks deciding to sell up?
I wonder if we’ll see some weight off the shoulders of Rafa & the players? Wouldn’t be surprised if having them as owners (knowing that there were no funds available) played on Rafa’s mind a bit – not that I’m offering this up as any excuse for the season, but it/they must have had a depressing influence on the playing & managerial staff?

Well, it’s one step in the right direction (the Yanks out).

Arthur, I had the same disgusted feeling as you’ve mentioned in #252 about what they said.

Let’s continue hoping for better news

Arthur, we’ll just have to see. The main problem still remains. Hicks and Gillett over value the club. Nobody is willing to meet their asking price. If the reports about RBS extending the repayment deadline 6 months are true then we won’t see any development for a few months at least, we’ll still have an interest payment to make, and that means no spending for yet another transfer window. It’s likely we won’t have CL money so maybe we’ll have to sell players like Benny, Riera, Babel and replace them with free transfers and the bargain basement rejects.

I read that Rafa’s agent had a meeting with an official from Juventus. Reports are that they are offering Rafa a £16m 4 year contract and €70m transfer kitty.

I reckon Real Madrid will also be sniffing around Rafa once the season ends.

We could have no dough and no manager and disillusioned players. A lot of fans would still expect a new manager to come and compete for the title no doubt though.

Well halla fucken luya, isn’t this a piece o brilliant news..surely we can get some decent owners and give the manager and the players the backing and confidence they and us fans need. A stable well run LFC is what im focusing on now, OH and as far as the statement that slicks and gullet put out ..and arthur kindly wrote out….they can cram them words up thier cramhole!!!

SOS statement

In another week where the name of Liverpool Football Club has become a byword for embarrassment, mismanagement and everything that is wrong off the field in the modern game, we have reports that Martin Broughton, Chairman of British Airways, is to become the Club’s Independent Chairman to settle the continuing squabbles between Liverpool FC’s warring owners.

As always, the supporters are considered secondary in all of this – starved of information and influence, ignored by Managing Director Christian Purslow despite reasonable requests to him for information about the immediate future of our Club.

If, as expected, Martin Broughton is appointed this week, then Spirit of Shankly will respectfully but firmly ask for an early meeting with him to seek answers to the questions that supporters want answering now:

1. Who appointed you?
2. What is your role and objectives?
3. Who is running the Club?
4. What are the immediate implications for the team on the pitch and the urgent squad strengthening called for by the playing staff?
5. Is our Club for sale?
6. If the Club is for sale, what criteria, other than the asking price will you apply in accepting any bid?
7. Would you speak to supporters’ representatives about a stake being taken in the Club by them?
8. If not, why not?

While the news this week might herald the beginning of the end for Hicks and Gillett and them leaving on a jet plane (probably an LFC expenses jet not British Airways we’re afraid Martin) more questions are posed. Spirit of Shankly will continue to make Tom and George “Not Welcome” but will concentrate upon the immediate future if that is Martin Broughton and the medium term future, if new owners or investors come in.

Additionally, the Premier League continue to ignore fans who have asked pertinent questions about their “fit and proper” test (or in our Club’s case “Fat and Prosper” test) – ignoring us will not work. If you won’t respond or meet with us, then as Tom and George have seen we’ll be down to see you at our convenience.

Another chapter in the misfortunes of LFC this season, “Fernando Torres likely to miss the game against Wet Spam due to knee injury, Torres was supposed to fly back to Spain but was cancelled because of flight restrictions due to the volcanic dust cloud from Iceland”, you could’nt make it up could you.
Great news for LFC regarding G&H, i know we wont see immediate results, but an old chinese proverb comes to mind “a thousand miles is started by a single step”.
RIP the 96.

Just in,
“the cloud of dust which has blanketed Europe closing most airports has been tracked back to Everton fc.
Apparently the cleaner gave the trophy cabinet a wipe”.

Well I think the next thing we all need to starting praying to the tooth fairy for, is that the Yanks (or Wanks – I like that Rafalution ) do not get their 6 month extension (in July is it?)

Then we’ll see the c*nts truly sweat as they will have to re-value the club – the vultures will circle and they’ll have to get out with some form of profit.

Jesus, they really are nothing but common thieves are they?

Good FUCKING RIDDANCE

I’ve just seen the interview re-the sale of the Club and I’m impressed by him. He may be a Chelsea fan but I am very optimistic and the interesting thing is that one of the conditions is for a new stadium to be built.Size-I don’t know but it’s bound to be bigger and that means more funds and season tickets.

The Pearce is bored in work. Good news about those Yank cunts, lets just hope they sell to the right person.

Trivia Question for you all:-Since 2000 can you name the 4 players to score on their debut for Liverpool?

Arthur – I think what Ax was saying is that banks live off debt so it would be a shrewd business decision for them to refinance.

So, unfortunately, the Borrowers get their way…an extension, a shift to their preferred bank who’ll play ball and not push for sale of the club and a continuing valuation based on pie-in-the-sky greed.

It’s interesting that they’re using the financial improvements to suggest that the club is worth more but if I was a buyer I would want to pay less for the club because of this as there would be less improvement possible for me to make with lesser margins in future. Says me & I know nowt.

They’re not billionaires for no reason (in fact, are they actually billionnaires at all? seeing as they don’t seem to have ever bought anything with their own money!)

We’ve heard the same thing for years now, so, once bitten twice shy, I’m not buying what they’re selling.

The Pearce: We talking proper debut, not pre-season nonsense?

Yes mate proper debut. I should help you by saying one of them was a well shite youngster we signed who never made the grade. The others are all internationals.

El Hajd Diouf is one.

Abel Xavier
Marc Gonzales
Craig Bellamy
Gabriel Paletta

cisse?

Cisse definitely yeah as is Diouf (God, he was one of our all time worst ever signings)

not sure about the others though

London Barnes has got the 4 (Obviously from the same source as me.) not sure why Cisse isn’t in the list cos I would’ve thought he was too. I think Diouf only scored on his home Debut.

Here’s my source:-
http://www.lfchistory.net/stats_goalindebut.asp
We played AK Graz away before the Spurs game when Cisse scored so presumably he appeared in that game.

That was my source as well.

More proof how crazy it is at Real Madrid. They have the most points they have EVER had after 32 games in a league season. And they’ll likely sack their coach. Lol.

Interesting interview with our new Chairman, Martin Broughton.

http://www.liverpoolfc.tv/eseason/News-and-Interviews/09-10/Martin-Broughto-18314.php3

Ivcjmac, Good to have you back. Thanks for shring that great post.

I remain sceptical until I see the new owner/s taking over us. What if this search for new owner is dragged on and on for the next two years or so with the ‘reasonable’ pricetag is set at 500M? And whilst the same excuse of not having the funds to buy players is churned out, to the extent of really frustrating Rafa before he leaves for greener pastures.

i wouldnt worry abt the search being dragged for too long – once the pricks have decided to leave, no sense in them having to stump up any money that might go in paying interest. the value of the club is the sum of the value of debt plus equity (this is the fuzzy number and depends on what D&D feel) minus any cash on the balance sheet. if £237MM is the debt, i reckon anything in the region of £400-450MM should be a good figure and should also satisfy the two idiots.

the big q for me is – how do we get some of our ‘fans’ to fuck off as well.

YNWA

First things first,Happy birthday Rafa.

The Hillsborough service yesterday was nice.Justice for the 96 and families.

Good news that its official now.I hope it dosen`t drag on too long.The sooner they`rte gone the sooner we can move forward.

Just got me tickets sorted for the Athleti game.Sweet.

Happy birthday rafa I hope you will be celebrating your 60th at anfield with a few title wins under your belt.

I do hope we don’t end up with new owners who promise the earth and deliver nothing.

What we all need to remember is how we felt when gillet and hicks took over.

Probably the same feeling we had when El’Hadj Diouf signed,hoping for the best and expecting miracles.

Personally I think football is always gonna be a heart over head experience.

And long may it continue.

Big up rafa ah yu run tings

Indeed happy birthday to Rafa. Strange his birthday being so lose to the aniversary.

Here is my take on Thicks exit. It is not of their own doing solely.
I reckon they have been pushed by the fact that they (or RBS through Purslow) have simply been unable to source the 100ml Str needed to keep the bank sweet.
It makes sense really. Football and the EPL in particular is going through a rough, rough time and there is a sense that the pendulum is beginning to swing away from England. Who is going to stump up 100ml for a minority share in a business that doesn’t look so secure? Let alone go into business with these 2 known asset strippers?

So what would a potential investor do ? I would wait until the pressure on THicks (from RBS) got to the point where they have to sell. And furthermore I’d wait until the “finance available i.e extention on the loan” was in turn up. Squeeze the fuckers until they have no choice.
The value of the club is 100% what someone is willing to pay for it (Just ask any Paddy with a house in negative equity and he’ll explain very clearly to you).

In other, simple words use RBS against Thicks. It does not matter what valuation they put on the club, it doesn’t matter even what ever figure they decide is “the Club’s debt” (which is their debt in reality). Ultimately they owe the bank.

So thicks can sing and dance as they like but it’s a buyer’s market and if they are forced to sell well they might yet get their arses handed to themselves.

On top of that they, if they were to stick it out and force Liverpool to pay the interest by selling their assets, are therefore devaluing the very brand producct they are trying to offload. So they lose there to.

I know sugar all about economics but I live in Ireland, there is a major recession beginning here and there has been a subsequent crash in house prices and I now, painfully, know what it’s like to be a seller in a buyer’s market. I think there are parallels with the ‘Pool situation.

As for the new Chelsea supporting mandated overseer it’s just going right out of orbit as far as the ans are concerned. Business boys. We are a product, a brand, a commodity to be traded.

Here’s a write up on the Hillborough Affair from Liverpool Supporter’s Club in far flung Malaysia.
It is written by Jit-Eng Niuh. He makes me proud to be a member of LSCM and a Liverpool fan.

“When the great Bill Shankly said football matters more than life and death, one would be forgiven for thinking it is so. After all it stirs our imagination and passion to the point of fanaticism and sometimes violence. But in reality the game of football is just that: a game, which we have unfortunately taken for granted in our quest to attain bragging rights and one upmanship with our rivals.
Of course, we want passionate fans who would “lose a limb’ for the cause. After all, what’s football without this type of supporters but sadly, a number of Liverpool fans, justifiably or not, have become increasingly critical and downright hostile towards the team and manager. Granted, 10 defeats thus far with four Premiership matches left to go and six points behind fourth placed Spurs in the race for the final Champions League spot isn’t good reading for the fans. However, wasn’t it someone who said, “when the going gets tough, the tough gets going?” What happened to the moniker: Liverpool fans are the best supporters in the world? Looks like some of us are nothing more than leeches who join in the celebration of the team’s triumphs but pour scorn whenever they begin to falter. It is on this backdrop of discontent that I’d like to remind fans and myself that there’s a bigger picture out there, a grander scheme of things, especially one which directly impacts Liverpool FC even now as it did 21 years ago yesterday: the Hillsborough Stadium tragedy which occurred during our FA Cup semi-final clash with Nottingham Forest. Putting this into context, don’t you think our ranting and raving about the fluctuating fortunes of the Reds pale in comparison to the grief felt by the families who were affected by that horrible incident in 1989 where eventually 96 Liverpool fans lost their lives in a human crush at the start of that match? While we still have the luxury and expediency to “change modes” in the way we support the Reds, these families’ lives would have been irrevocably changed by this unfortunate incident.
I can never begin to understand the hurt they must have suffered although I lost my father 20 years ago because at least I knew the circumstances surround his death while these good people are still waiting for a proper closure to this dark chapter in their lives. Although the subsequent inquest into the disaster outlined in the Taylor Report produced a scathing censure on the police force’s callous actions on that fateful day, no one until this day was ever brought to justice for the crimes committed.
So, it is with great admiration and humility that I applaud the endless efforts of people like Margaret Aspinall, the chair and Trevor Hicks, president of the Hillsborough Family Support Group (HSFG) and their team for continuing to fight for the affected family members. For their part, the UK Government have also stepped up to help, albeit belatedly and after much consternation, find a resolution by appointing an eight-person panel (Hillsborough Independent Panel) to oversee the release of official documents related to the event.
This exercise which involves the HFSG, Hillsborough Justice Campaign, South Yorkshire Police, Sheffield Wednesday FC, relevant persons and authorities, hopes to get to the bottom of the truth.
But their quest may take years to accomplish due to the mountains of documents that have to be sorted. If there was one good thing that came out of this calamity, it was the compulsory transformation of the stadiums in England into all-seater arenas, making them much safer and visitor friendly.
The way games are now monitored and controlled have also improved tremendously with the deployment of an army of stewards, more police presence and extensive use of CCTV – all in an effort to prevent another tragedy of this scale from ever happening again.
In this sense, those who lost their lives that afternoon did not die in vain but ccontributed immensely to the higher safety standards in crowd control and stadium design everywhere. In the meantime, let us take a moment to reflect on the human toll of this tragedy and empathise with the affected family members, who still live with the pain, despair and sense of injustice from this horrible tragedy which we, from afar, can only imagine.
Perhaps, when we do so, we can look beyond our predilection for instant gratification from our loyalty to the Reds which leaves no room for a more sober and deliberate assessment of the more important things in life.
This includes a sense of belonging to a shared cause, patience and loyalty – things that are in very short supply right now amongst many e fans who fly off the handle at the slightest sight of trouble.
I have to admit, I myself have fallen into this funk of blaming the players, coaches, manager or whatnot when the Reds falter but at the end of the day, like I’ve said many times before: Supporting Liverpool is never a compulsion but a life long devotion, warts and all!
For those who can’t hack it, you know where the exit door is while for the rest of us, it’s the Reds all the way come what may. Here’s to the 96 souls who perished on this day 21 years ago. You Have Never Walked Alone. God bless.”

I believe we might have yet another strange predicament on our hands. Apparently, Torres needs to travel to Spain to see the specialist who’s previously been treating his knee, and only then will he be able to recover in time to play our upcoming games. Because of the volcanic ash, however, the trip to Spain will have to be postponed.

Some reports I’ve read claim this volcanic ash will continue to interfere with European air traffic for some time to some. There have just been too many unlikely incidents like these affecting us this season. It’s like one of those days you have when everything just goes against you.

Regarding the ownership developments, I have to admit Martin Broughton seems like a competent man. I don’t think he would have accepted the position as chairman unless he was confident he could do a good job and bring the club forward. People like these are essential to successful football clubs these days, like it or not. Still, he will have to live up to his word and I’m not getting my hopes up until the yanks are officially out. But I do say this: if Mr. Broughton can actually find new investors who’ll buy the americans out, get rid of the debt with their own dough, build the new stadium, bring the club forward by supporting Rafa with enough cash to challenge for CL spots and beyond; and not least of all – let the club yet again be run the Liverpool Way. If Mr. Broughton can achieve all of this he should have his statue raised right next to Shankly’s, because in all honesty I don’t think there are any investors on the planet Earth who’d be willing to do all of this.

For the first time in my life I actually wanted Manchester United to win today – and they duly obliged with a final minute of injury time winner over Manchester City at Eastlands. For once I am pleased that they are the jammy fuckers that they always have been.

And guess what? I will want them to win for the second time ever next week when they play Spurs, providing of course that Chelsea beat Spurs later today.

Looking at the fixtures that City and Spurs have to come, I think 4th place is still on for LFC.

I was as depressed as any other red after the draws at Birmingham, and particularly at home to Fulham last Sunday. But, with just four Prem games to go, there is all to play for.

We must win all four to finish on a paltry 68 points, and hope that Man.City, Spurs and Villa drop points.

We need City to lose to Arsenal away, for example, and then draw with Villa (which would have the double effect of Villa dropping the two points that we need them to drop) and then City drawing at home to Spurs (double effect again, with Spurs dropping two points at the same time) and then drawing at West Ham on the final day. It’s funny, but nobody seems to beat West Ham on the final day! Check it out.

As for Spurs, their victory over Arsenal in midweek has made things trickier for us, but apart from our need for them to draw at Man.City, we need them to lose at Old Trafford next week (preferbably quite heavily) as I think Chelsea will beat them today as well, but I fully expect them to take maximum points at home v Bolton and when they visit Burnley.

I am hoping for a heavyish defeat for them (most likely at Old trafford) as I can see us and Tottenham (and possibly Man.City as well) all finishing on 68 points, and at the moment we are a few goals behind them both in the goal difference stakes.

Of course, all this depends on us winning all of our games and this in itself is a tall order, particularly Chelsea at home. I just hope they are at least 4 points clear of the Mancs when they come to Anfield on 2nd May. Perhaps we can rack up a few goals at an already doomed Burnley next week?

I know I’m clutching at straws, but is there anything else left?

Here’s hoping!

Forget it Steve, its not happening.

Ya straw clutching alright steve,spurs are two up.

No way now chelsea will win

I`d rather see spurs go in instead of city.

Nice post 281 from Knight.Well said by your pal.

Agreed… if they win this… and against 10 men, they likely will, there’s no way Spurs drop 8 points now.

And Steve… if the Ash doesn’t dissipate, it also means we have to take a long train journey to Madrid… and a long train journey back!
And with our luck… flights will be back on when they have to come to Anfield!
Bloody Typical!

Oh well, I must admit it’s looking difficult now. I didn’t expect Spurs to beat Chelsea at all. Guess that’s what happens when you end up relying on other teams.

Aitch, I think UEFA are set to make a decision on Monday as to whether next Thursday’s semi final first leg ties can go ahead.

We play West Ham on Monday night, if we have to travel to Madrid by train it would be a disaster.

We can fly there as late as Wednesday. Let’s hope it’s cleared up by then.

It erupted again today Steve, so I can’t see it clearing up any time soon.
If its not one thing, this season, its another.

Spurs have really turned it on. ManCiteh lost because they were playing not to loose rather than to win. When they were breaking,going for corners it was clearly evident that Mancini’s cautious tactics was playing spoilsport.

As for our chances, to be fair it became difficult when we drew against Birmingham and then Fulham.I dont want ManUnited to win the title. Thts the main thing.

As for our owners and their desire to sell together,i think inspite of the valuations of 500-600m LFC will attract lot of investors simply because ne owners wont have to deal with these existing yanks.

I know what you mean Aitch, it seems even nature is against us.

Spare a thought for me though. My In-Laws were supposed to be flying back to Spain today, but now it seems that I will be stuck with them for some time to come!

Life is really shit at the moment.

I’m sorry to say this but it seems to me that shower of dispicable heart wrenching scum bags are destined to win the title. To me everything works in cycles it did for us during our 20year rein and all the great teams before us.
As much as I believe that their time is closing to an end I still think it’s written for them to bag a few more major honours. I can’t even bring myself to write it but you know what one I’m specifically talking about.
By Christ I hope I’m wrong, I hope this is just senseless football mad drivel I’m spouting but I’m seriously considering putting (2k) my only savings on them. I really don’t think I’d mind losing it!!
Chelsea look like they are gonna drop more points reguardless of what way are game ends up with them, and spurs will bottle it(like they always do at old Trafford) and will still have enough points to cruse into forth.

1. The filth
2. Chelsea
3. Arsenal
4. Spurs

It’s my prediction and I hope it’s wrong, but to be honest just want this season over with.

Roll on next season redmen.

If our game against Athleti is postponed due to mother nature wont that give Nando more time to recover and attain full fitness before the semi final thus boosting our chances of winning the tie? Wouldent that therefore mean mother nature is giving us an advantage and is in fact with us and not against us? Nah….probably not!…..

snarky “probably not” answered courtesy of the BBC.com
“Liverpool striker Fernando Torres will miss the rest of the season following knee surgery on Sunday.”

Yeah, just saw it on Sly Sports News as well. That just about puts the top hat on our season now.

Let’s hope Chelsea win their last 3 (including Anfield) cos we ain’t winning anythng apart from 7th place!

Ya well,it kinda sums up our season really.Torres is out for six weeks.Looking dodgey for the world cup too.I`m gutted for the lad personally but i`m a liverpool supporter and i hope he dosen`t play in the world cup.
He will get long overdue proper rest,Full summer off.This way he won`t be pulling up every three weeks.
Again i`m gutted for him but this could turn out to be good news in the long run for LFC.

Ahhh….answered indeed. Get well soon Nando. Guess this means em….fate, yeah fate is against us not planet earth right? Cos thats just crazy talk right?!

O.K Digger, we’ll settle for saying that it’s just fate against us then. But could it be any worse or any “crazier” if planet earth was against us as well?

Timmy,I really hope FT doesen’t make any part of the World Cup either. Fuck Spain, LFC comes first.

How many times has he fucked himself up playing for Spain anyway? Those cunts couldn’t give a shit about LFC. They have played him in friendlies, yes, fucking friendlies when he’s only been half fit in the past.

Three months complete rest and a return to training in mid July should see a rejuvenated FT pulling on the Famous red shirt again in August.

Well, yeah Stevie, saying planet earth is against us IS crazy talk. So is adding fate or karma or beachballs or other such nonsense to that mix. Aint no fate but the one you make mate. LB said it best when he said our 2 best players are crocks. They are. This hasnt sank in with Nando or Stevie yet but when they next trot off to play meaningless friendlys or mickey mouse confederation cups instead of giving their crocked bodies time to recuperate and regenerate, it just might. Sorry mate, I’m just fucked off

Sorry to hear that about Nando.
Tho’ I kind of agree with Digger 298… himself and Stevie to a large extent brought it on themselves. I keep going back to Mr F-Manure and Giggs. That’s how you mix the 2 committments.
That said I do feel sorry for ‘Nando. The World Cup is as big as it gets and this is the big chance for Spain.
Too bad.
He also misses Atletico and we are going to miss him to boot.
A cracker of a season eh !

Share similar sentiments to all in here – what a fuckin season!

will be astonished if we win the Europa Cup now – but still hope we can

I wouldent be astonished if we did to be honest Arthur. In fact it wouldent surprise me at all. I’ll say one thing for Rafa, when ever things are going tits up domestically he always masterminds a backs against the wall win or magical run in Europe to save the season. It wont be pretty, in fact it’ll be dour (my moneys on 2 penalty shootouts) but it’s within our repetoire to pull it off. 4th is gone (looong gone) so our sole focus will be these 2 one-off games. And who’s the man for one-off games my man?!